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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2019 15:33:30 GMT -6
It would be nice to have such thing in the game, but what would happen would probably be that many AI nations would tend to build their ships in foreign ports. Which brings me to another idea - what about the ability to directly spy others ships that are being build or refited in your ports? That would not be that far-fetched IMHO.
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Post by dizzy on Feb 9, 2019 11:56:57 GMT -6
On the offhand this discussion has any weight on future design work, I read this interesting tidbit about the Japanese Kongo class Battlecruisers that were refitted to Fast Battleships and served all through ww2.
"Due to a shortage of available slipways, Haruna and her sister ship Kirishima were the first two capital ships of the Imperial Japanese Navy to be built in private shipyards."
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Post by oldpop2000 on Feb 9, 2019 13:27:05 GMT -6
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Post by dizzy on Feb 9, 2019 16:21:45 GMT -6
That's a really cool resource! Thanks for sharing. It's interesting how the Japs focused almost entirely on CV production in 1941 till the end of the war.
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Post by cwemyss on Feb 9, 2019 18:36:10 GMT -6
That's a really cool resource! Thanks for sharing. It's interesting how the Japs focused almost entirely on CV production in 1941 till the end of the war. STOP USING THAT TERM. You can't claim role playing this time. Edit: somewhere else on this forum you claim to be a writer. It doesn't speak well of your writing if you can't manage to express yourself without resorting to lazy, racist terminology.
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Post by garychildress on Feb 10, 2019 8:30:41 GMT -6
That's a really cool resource! Thanks for sharing. It's interesting how the Japs focused almost entirely on CV production in 1941 till the end of the war. STOP USING THAT TERM. You can't claim role playing this time. Edit: somewhere else on this forum you claim to be a writer. It doesn't speak well of your writing if you can't manage to express yourself without resorting to lazy, racist terminology. You mean the term "Japs"? If so, then is "Japs" really a disparaging term? I would think it's just short for "Japanese". I sometimes use the term "Brits" when I post about some game I'm playing that involves British units. Am I being "racist" against the British when I do so? I know there are people who call us "Yanks". Heck I've even seen people refer to the Germans in their WW2 computer games as "Huns". However, I don't think I've ever seen anyone complain about any of these titles on a gaming forum until now.
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Post by noshurviverse on Feb 10, 2019 8:57:05 GMT -6
Dockyard limitations probably wouldn't affect me too much, seeing as how I like to play smaller nations with budgets just barely capable of keeping one or two capitals in construction. Even so, I think it could be a neat feature that could certainly place the player in interesting scenarios. I wouldn't make it a priority feature, since I prefer things that show up a bit more boldly in gameplay but it's still good. STOP USING THAT TERM. You can't claim role playing this time. Edit: somewhere else on this forum you claim to be a writer. It doesn't speak well of your writing if you can't manage to express yourself without resorting to lazy, racist terminology. You mean the term "Japs"? If so, then is "Japs" really a disparaging term? I would think it's just short for "Japanese". I sometimes use the term "Brits" when I post about some game I'm playing that involves British units. Am I being "racist" against the British when I do so? I know there are people who call us "Yanks". Heck I've even seen people refer to the Germans in their WW2 computer games as "Huns". However, I don't think I've ever seen anyone complain about any of these titles on a gaming forum until now. I can't say I've seen "Jap" taken as a derogatory term in many cases, although it's clearly very informal and perhaps unsuitable for any official business. While I rarely see it used, I feel the term "Nip" is somewhat harsher, despite being a contraction of "Nippon", the formal native word for Japan. Of course, from a WWII context the terms "*****" and "Jerry" are extremely common. I also believe that, at least in the Philippines, "Ami" can be used to refer to Americans.
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Post by garychildress on Feb 10, 2019 9:18:17 GMT -6
Dockyard limitations probably wouldn't affect me too much, seeing as how I like to play smaller nations with budgets just barely capable of keeping one or two capitals in construction. Even so, I think it could be a neat feature that could certainly place the player in interesting scenarios. I wouldn't make it a priority feature, since I prefer things that show up a bit more boldly in gameplay but it's still good. You mean the term "Japs"? If so, then is "Japs" really a disparaging term? I would think it's just short for "Japanese". I sometimes use the term "Brits" when I post about some game I'm playing that involves British units. Am I being "racist" against the British when I do so? I know there are people who call us "Yanks". Heck I've even seen people refer to the Germans in their WW2 computer games as "Huns". However, I don't think I've ever seen anyone complain about any of these titles on a gaming forum until now. I can't say I've seen "Jap" taken as a derogatory term in many cases, although it's clearly very informal and perhaps unsuitable for any official business. While I rarely see it used, I feel the term "Nip" is somewhat harsher, despite being a contraction of "Nippon", the formal native word for Japan. Of course, from a WWII context the terms "*****" and "Jerry" are extremely common. I also believe that, at least in the Philippines, "Ami" can be used to refer to Americans. Good point concerning "Nip". I was curious, so I hunted down the thread where Dizzy was using the term "Jap". It appears he used it in the phrase "Dirty Jap" in the context of a surprise attack in his game he was playing, which is maybe a little out there, perhaps. I don't know. However, again, on gaming forums I've seen all kinds of things attributable to the historical context of the games people are playing. I've seen reference to "Yankee imperialist dogs" and all manner of stuff used when describing their gaming experiences, even in games where people are playing as the Taliban or something contemporary. Usually, like Dizzy's comment I figure it's people getting carried away by the games and I seldom say anything about it. Maybe I should. I don't know.
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Post by garychildress on Feb 10, 2019 9:42:50 GMT -6
Dockyard limitations probably wouldn't affect me too much, seeing as how I like to play smaller nations with budgets just barely capable of keeping one or two capitals in construction. Even so, I think it could be a neat feature that could certainly place the player in interesting scenarios. I wouldn't make it a priority feature, since I prefer things that show up a bit more boldly in gameplay but it's still good. I usually play as Japan when I'm not playing as a custom nation. Playing as GB or the US gets a little unmanageable for me sometimes. So yes, slip availability probably wouldn't be an issue under those circumstances. So that's a good point.
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Post by cwemyss on Feb 10, 2019 11:48:14 GMT -6
You mean the term "Japs"? If so, then is "Japs" really a disparaging term? I would think it's just short for "Japanese". I sometimes use the term "Brits" when I post about some game I'm playing that involves British units. Am I being "racist" against the British when I do so? I know there are people who call us "Yanks". Heck I've even seen people refer to the Germans in their WW2 computer games as "Huns". However, I don't think I've ever seen anyone complain about any of these titles on a gaming forum until now. All of those, in context (say, in-character in an AAR) are a different conversation. They were commonly used expressions in the period, and while any or all of them are likely to offend a modern audience to varying degrees, it's at least defensible in that context. Using most of them in the course of a face-to-face conversation in 2019, with people from those various nations, would not be acceptable. This strives to be a professional forum and clearly has an international audience, discourse should at least rise to the level of "Would i say this in person?" At a minimum it's lazy shorthand. At worst it's jarring, unprofessional, and offensive.
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Post by garychildress on Feb 10, 2019 12:30:56 GMT -6
You mean the term "Japs"? If so, then is "Japs" really a disparaging term? I would think it's just short for "Japanese". I sometimes use the term "Brits" when I post about some game I'm playing that involves British units. Am I being "racist" against the British when I do so? I know there are people who call us "Yanks". Heck I've even seen people refer to the Germans in their WW2 computer games as "Huns". However, I don't think I've ever seen anyone complain about any of these titles on a gaming forum until now. All of those, in context (say, in-character in an AAR) are a different conversation. They were commonly used expressions in the period, and while any or all of them are likely to offend a modern audience to varying degrees, it's at least defensible in that context. Using most of them in the course of a face-to-face conversation in 2019, with people from those various nations, would not be acceptable. This strives to be a professional forum and clearly has an international audience, discourse should at least rise to the level of "Would i say this in person?" At a minimum it's lazy shorthand. At worst it's jarring, unprofessional, and offensive. Appreciate the FYI. I'll try to watch my use of "Brits" from now on. Most of the time I just type "British" but once in a while I've shortened it. "The Brits won the battle," for example. No offense intended. Just "lazy" I guess.
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Post by dizzy on Feb 10, 2019 14:22:08 GMT -6
That's a really cool resource! Thanks for sharing. It's interesting how the Japs focused almost entirely on CV production in 1941 till the end of the war. STOP USING THAT TERM. You can't claim role playing this time. Edit: somewhere else on this forum you claim to be a writer. It doesn't speak well of your writing if you can't manage to express yourself without resorting to lazy, racist terminology. Bing 'Jap' and you get the Oxford dictionary description as follows along with a pronunciation: Jap [jap] NOUN Japs (plural noun) 1. a Japanese person. ADJECTIVE 2. Japanese. Now look, you and your politically correct friends can take your perceived slights and stick them where the sun doesn't shine. I'm really growing weary of you trying to force your PC make believe that isn't even accurate upon everyone else like it's some Holy Crusade. You can STOP. Now. As for using derogatory terms, context is everything and again, as last time, it's not being directed toward any one individual. I'll refrain from giving you a lesson in word etymology, but while we are talking about abbreviations, Brits, and other shorts like it are wholly acceptable. I suggest you get off your soapbox, stop trying to 'change' world perceptions, leave me the hell alone, and put on your big britches and deal with reality or these 'triggers' that get you so riled up, will likely land you in therapy or with a drinking problem. Back to Shipyard slips, looking at that latest resource about Jap ship building, did the Brits use private shipyards? Did they produce any ships in India? Australia? I'm beginning to think that tracking ship building slipyards is best left to abstract game mechanics.
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Post by garychildress on Feb 10, 2019 15:27:10 GMT -6
Back to Shipyard slips, looking at that latest resource about Jap ship building, did the Brits use private shipyards? Did they produce any ships in India? Australia? I'm beginning to think that tracking ship building slipyards is best left to abstract game mechanics. I don't believe any of the major commonwealth members other than Great Britain had shipbuilding industries developed to the point of being able to build capital ships--including Canada, India and Australia (BC Australia was built in Great Britain despite its namesake) and really it's capital ship slips that I was talking about in the OP. I don't think it would make much sense (or be much fun) to track smaller slipways. But for capital ships it was a problem for some countries (especially during war mobilization) to find available space at times to lay down new ships as quickly as they would have liked. But RTW is a great game either way. Most of the time the fleets I've been able to build aren't as large as historically was the case anyway, due to budget constraints in the game. And it would probably just be more headaches to add it to the game and delay release and is really not that critical, I don't think. It's not something I'm particularly worried about. It was just something I had thought of and wanted to put out there for people's ideas.
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Post by aeson on Feb 10, 2019 16:46:53 GMT -6
Bing 'Jap' and you get the Oxford dictionary description as follows along with a pronunciation: Jap [jap] NOUN Japs (plural noun) 1. a Japanese person. ADJECTIVE 2. Japanese. There are contexts in which derogatory terms may be acceptable. General conversation is not one of them, regardless of whether or not the term is directed at any specific individual.
Also, I don't care about whether or not a word is politically correct, but refusing to refrain from the use of pejoratives after having been asked to stop by someone who finds it offensive is simply rude - especially when you knew that the word in question is generally considered to be a pejorative prior to being asked to stop using it instead of being unaware of the word's derogatory nature prior to being asked.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Feb 10, 2019 17:17:54 GMT -6
The bottom line in this instance is Wiliam asked for it to stop being used on his forum, so point and counter-point well taken, let us indeed return merrily to shipyards.
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