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Post by thenewteddy on Apr 9, 2019 1:30:28 GMT -6
I seem to be truly awful at this; and am looking for any tips.
As a secondary/bonus question; were WW1 era battles really like this? If you zoom out far enough during a battle to where its just dots, it was like two groups of ants running around all over the place but moving in pack formation. Is that what WW1 battles really would have looked like or is that just how the game works?
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Post by MateDow on Apr 9, 2019 1:53:33 GMT -6
Sink the other guy's ships before he sinks you. In seriousness, maneuver your ships to bring your weapons to bear while trying to prevent them from doing the same. Change course regularly so that torpedoes fired at you will be less effective. Those are probably the two things that, once you master them, will allow you win most of your battles. As for historical naval battles, they did involve complicated maneuvers by both sides.
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Post by dorn on Apr 9, 2019 2:05:38 GMT -6
I seem to be truly awful at this; and am looking for any tips. As a secondary/bonus question; were WW1 era battles really like this? If you zoom out far enough during a battle to where its just dots, it was like two groups of ants running around all over the place but moving in pack formation. Is that what WW1 battles really would have looked like or is that just how the game works?
You should compare your ships with enemy ships, identify the right distance you will have advantage. And you need to play at that advantage in battle.
Some examples: You have advantage in destroyers, visibility is not good, just close and try to make torpedo attack You both have same caliber guns but you have a little better armour, close as much you can that your armour can hold.
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Post by thenewteddy on Apr 9, 2019 2:15:25 GMT -6
how do I know what distance is to my advantage?
also, how do I tell destroyers to close in?
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Post by dorn on Apr 9, 2019 2:48:02 GMT -6
how do I know what distance is to my advantage? also, how do I tell destroyers to close in? You need to analyze your ship to enemy ship.
You know your ship well as you designed it. You can choose "Open design" through right clicking on ship list in "In service".
You can open "Almanac", choose any nation, choose any ship and double click on any ship. If ship is in active service you get some information about that design, mainly her armmament, tonnage, speed and armour belt. Things which are not visible easily as speed and armour belt could vary from reality as intelligence could be a little wrong.
From that if you open your design window, you can choose main gun caliber and click on "gun data" to see penetration value for certain thickness of armour. From that you can analyze and estimate immunity zones.
I would strongly suggest read manual first, there is a lot of information.
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Post by JagdFlanker on Apr 9, 2019 2:49:01 GMT -6
how do I know what distance is to my advantage? also, how do I tell destroyers to close in? a good way to judge the best broadside distance to the enemy is to mount torpedoes on your capital ships and turn on the torpedo range circle in battles, then make sure you stay just outside torpedo range
it helps a lot if you build ships with good speed - the ai builds their start game B's to go 19kts so i build my start game B's to go 21/22kts so i can either chase down and overtake the enemy or withdraw on my own terms. i also build CA's to go 23/24kts, and CL's 24/25kts. speed = control of the battle
to tell DD's to close in just right click on your flagship task force and click on the 'order flotilla attack' button (far right). keep in mind the first 10 years of the game your DD's will not follow orders very well so don't expect much of them, but mid-late game they get deadly, especially if they have 4 or more torpedo mounts. to increase fleet effectiveness as fast as possible i personally put 'fleet tactics' research on high priority
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Post by thenewteddy on Apr 9, 2019 3:01:20 GMT -6
Sink the other guy's ships before he sinks you. In seriousness, maneuver your ships to bring your weapons to bear while trying to prevent them from doing the same. Change course regularly so that torpedoes fired at you will be less effective. Those are probably the two things that, once you master them, will allow you win most of your battles. As for historical naval battles, they did involve complicated maneuvers by both sides. yea but like exhibit A is a battle I just did exhibit B is what the pictures show exhibit WTF is my understanding of the battle I just did but drawn in the style of exhibit B
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Post by MateDow on Apr 9, 2019 4:42:54 GMT -6
yea but like exhibit A is a battle I just did exhibit B is what the pictures show exhibit WTF is my understanding of the battle I just did but drawn in the style of exhibit B The map of Java Sea combines the entire force into a single line, whereas the chart you posted shows individual ships. If you selected "force flagships" it would make a much clearer picture of the maneuvers.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 4:55:20 GMT -6
Mostly in daytime gunnery combat you just need to know what are your biggest guns and what are their biggest guns. If you have bigger guns, you should just keep your distance of 18 000 to 25 000 yds from the main enemy line of Bs/BBs. If you have smaller guns, you may either trust your armour and keep your distance, or rely on rate of fire and get to 5 000 to 15 000 yds. For example if you play as germany against france, you will see that french guns are usually bigger, but you usually have more guns and heavier armour. In long distance gunnery, they are most likely going to win, because even with their low quality guns, their deck penetration value is usually still enough to sink you. But if you get closer, you can just bury them under tens and hundreds of hits until they disappear under the waves...
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Apr 9, 2019 10:42:50 GMT -6
It might serve you to read one of the AARs which others have posted, as some of them discuss strategy in battle significantly. For my part, presuming you put a wise percentage of your budget into BC/BB-CA-CL-DD, as long as you do not dwell too long on older technologies you should have a fleet that is at least comparable to the enemy. My tactic when presented with the battle screen is to take stock of Wind direction (ideally maneuver to have smoke blowing behind you), Land masses (don't get forced against a shore, try to force your enemy against a shore), and Time of day. It is tempting to pursue opponents as dusk falls, but- don't, just don't. A victory could turn into an easy defeat when the range of torpedoes is greater than your sighting distance. My technique to win battles is to minimize course changes as much as possible- you get a "steady aim" bonus that the AI can seldom take advantage of. Turn only to avoid torpedo attacks and as otherwise necessary. And, if you take torpedo damage (especially before TPS) frequently you will get yourself more victory points by nursing that ship home than by trying further to damage the enemy. You will need 3 different tactics for 3 different eras. (and RTW2 brings in a 4th that we will not go into). In the pre-dreadnought era, all you can truly hope for is to cause 1 ship in the enemy line to fall out so it can be surrounded and destroyed. Most battles will be fought around 5-8000 yards, and torpedoes are a real danger. In the DN era ships can "pop" and otherwise take a terrible beating. Most battles will be resolved between 10 & 15,000 yards, and careful management of your fleet can lead to complete destruction of the enemy. In the WWII era, battles can frequently be decided at 20-30,000 yards, as a single hit can slow you and cause your options to become drastically limited. There are many fine details of battles with maps in aeson 's China AAR, and many more besides.
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Post by thenewteddy on Apr 9, 2019 11:12:34 GMT -6
what I'm hearing is "just click in the middle of where their ships are and hope for the best" is probably not a good strategy on my part; so I'll have to adjust my gameplay tactics.
I'll read the suggested threads.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Apr 9, 2019 11:37:39 GMT -6
That might produce superior results.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Apr 9, 2019 11:40:31 GMT -6
You know, this makes me pause to consider- has anyone, ever, done a "Beginner's Guide to Battle", a true step-by-step illustration of a line engagement? I don't believe we have.
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Post by thenewteddy on Apr 9, 2019 11:53:13 GMT -6
You know, this makes me pause to consider- has anyone, ever, done a "Beginner's Guide to Battle", a true step-by-step illustration of a line engagement? I don't believe we have. I can make one. but uh, I need to learn how to do it first. I find people who have recently learned how to do a thing tend to make the best tutorials as they have "what I didn't understand" fresh in their mind and thus can explain it well.
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Post by thenewteddy on Apr 9, 2019 12:00:24 GMT -6
so with that aim in mind a few questions that probably have super obvious answers but which I have no idea about:
what should I try to do? should I try to run parallel to the enemy so I can broadside him?
what speed should we run at? is there a "too fast?" and a "too slow?"
assuming all my guns are working, is there any use to turning my ships facing the other way, or (assuming my guns all keep working) should I keep the same side pointed at the enemy?
when I manage to get an enemy ship way out of the line of battle, and its all alone; what is the best way to sink it? should I circle it at close range? should I ram it?
is there a "rock, paper, scissors" to naval warfare; or should I match like with like? for example, should I send in my DD to sink his BB or take on his BB with my BB?
how can I tell what his ship stats are; I know how to view what guns they have, but how can I tell what their sighting range is?
lastly, is there any way I can have the AI run my ships; all of them, including my flagship, so I can watch what it does and try to learn from it?
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