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Post by rtwairversionwhen on Aug 3, 2019 14:54:45 GMT -6
Have the devs said how they will model jets, missiles etc? And if they have, where can I find their posts about them?
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Post by akosjaccik on Aug 3, 2019 15:04:47 GMT -6
I dont remember coming across any specifics about the missiles, and as far as jets go, if I recall correctly "anything above ~500kts can be considered jets" and that's it - esentialy, they are already in the game. You have to forgive me, I don't tend to neatly categorize random forum posts, so I do not know in exactly which topic did I read these.
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Post by mycophobia on Aug 3, 2019 15:14:14 GMT -6
I can confirm that Jet are just considered to be very fast planes and not treated very differently.
I don’t believe there are very concrete plans for missiles at this point.
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Post by aeson on Aug 3, 2019 19:27:54 GMT -6
as far as jets go, if I recall correctly "anything above ~500kts can be considered jets" and that's it - esentialy, they are already in the game. You have to forgive me, I don't tend to neatly categorize random forum posts, so I do not know in exactly which topic did I read these. Right idea, wrong number - it's ~400 knots (~460mph). At least, unless there's another such post somewhere by one of the other NWS team members.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Aug 3, 2019 20:53:30 GMT -6
No, 400 is what William's research told us. I think there was exactly one example of a 400 knot prop-driven naval aircraft, so we can just presume (until a day where the game might treat it more distinctly) that a 400 knot naval aircraft is an early jet.
Now in my personal head-canon (to abuse the terminology), I tend to see that if an upgraded version of a model (B, C, D, etc.) takes it over 400 knots it is in fact a highly tuned and upgraded turbo-prop type aircraft. In additional to personal preference, I don't know of a make or model that transitioned from prop to jet and maintained its former designation and nomenclature.
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Post by srndacful on Aug 3, 2019 22:16:48 GMT -6
Have the devs said how they will model jets, missiles etc? And if they have, where can I find their posts about them? Welcome to the forum, rtwairversionwhen - and I fully agree with your screenname: when are we going to Rule the Air, williammiller and Fredrik W?
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Post by dohboy on Aug 3, 2019 23:05:51 GMT -6
I'm not sure how 'Rule the Air' would work. You need a lot more pieces to put the puzzle together. Air superiority is invaluable in any military operation, but it is only a part of the equation if you want to do anything other than break stuff. A large part of the Pacific naval actions in WW2 were about ruling the air, so in a way we're already playing that game. You can't rule the air without an airfield or carrier underneath it.
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Post by akosjaccik on Aug 4, 2019 2:54:04 GMT -6
Right idea, wrong number - it's ~400 knots (~460mph). At least, unless there's another such post somewhere by one of the other NWS team members. Thanks for the clarification, in my defence I am an SI-guy
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Post by tbr on Aug 4, 2019 5:45:39 GMT -6
I don't know of a make or model that transitioned from prop to jet and maintained its former designation and nomenclature. The J7W1 had significant prop torque due to the engine's power, so a turbojet was planned for the J7W2. However, even the J7W1 only had two prototype flights, so this ishypothetical plans only. Aces of the Pacific had both planes in its '46 expansion though.
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Post by tbr on Aug 4, 2019 5:52:19 GMT -6
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bakara
Junior Member
Posts: 55
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Post by bakara on Aug 4, 2019 6:41:26 GMT -6
there was a Soviet aircraft that went through a similar remodel iirc
Edit: its the Yak-15(jet)/Yak-3(prop)
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Aug 4, 2019 7:22:48 GMT -6
I don't know of a make or model that transitioned from prop to jet and maintained its former designation and nomenclature. The J7W1 had significant prop torque due to the engine's power, so a turbojet was planned for the J7W2. However, even the J7W1 only had two prototype flights, so this ishypothetical plans only. Aces of the Pacific had both planes in its '46 expansion though. Oh gosh, there's a trip down memory lane. I used to play Aces of the Pacific to death. Never bought the expansion though.
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Post by asdfzxc922 on Aug 4, 2019 13:05:22 GMT -6
No, 400 is what William's research told us. I think there was exactly one example of a 400 knot prop-driven naval aircraft, so we can just presume (until a day where the game might treat it more distinctly) that a 400 knot naval aircraft is an early jet. There were four operational piston-engined naval fighters that all maxed out around 400kn (Sea Fury, Sea Hornet, Bearcat, Tigercat). The absolute limit for a prop fighter of any kind seems to be around 425kn.
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Post by tbr on Aug 4, 2019 17:25:18 GMT -6
No, 400 is what William's research told us. I think there was exactly one example of a 400 knot prop-driven naval aircraft, so we can just presume (until a day where the game might treat it more distinctly) that a 400 knot naval aircraft is an early jet. There were four operational piston-engined naval fighters that all maxed out around 400kn (Sea Fury, Sea Hornet, Bearcat, Tigercat). The absolute limit for a prop fighter of any kind seems to be around 425kn. The game uses an abstracted "operational" maximum speed which is a compromise between speeds @different altitudes. The absolute maximum in "clean" configuration (or even at half tank or so) and at ideal altitude (for the Sea Hornet @21kfeet) should not be the speed used for glide bombing attacks and air combat at low altitudes (e.g. when intercepting TB's). So 400kn as the "jet" limit is already a stretch.
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Post by srndacful on Aug 4, 2019 22:05:33 GMT -6
I'm not sure how 'Rule the Air' would work. You need a lot more pieces to put the puzzle together. Air superiority is invaluable in any military operation, but it is only a part of the equation if you want to do anything other than break stuff. A large part of the Pacific naval actions in WW2 were about ruling the air, so in a way we're already playing that game. You can't rule the air without an airfield or carrier underneath it. Well, for a start, it would have to be removed from just 'naval' aspect and take over the land-based operations as well. I don't know if you've ever played the 'Ancient Art of War in the Skies' game but the basic idea is similar: you are supporting the land and naval forces in their quest to beat the ... stuffing ... out of the enemy and win the war. To do this, you get a monthly budget which you can spend on designing and purchasing (government-designed&built) planes, building airfields, factories and squadrons and taking up (or refusing) civilian designs. Basically, think of it as a combination of current RtW2's Ship Design / Plane Order part of the game. And if you think for a second designing planes would be boring - think again: While the ships have a 'natural' propensity to float on water - aircraft have to actively work on keeping themselves up by using wings: so, which ones would you like? Small (lighter) ones - giving you smaller drag - and thus more speed, but making your plane less maneuverable and prone to stalling - or larger ones - reducing it's speed and available weight, but making it more maneuverable and forgiving. How about structure? You'd like to have a stronger one to maneuver better (and be shot down less) - but it costs a lot of preciuos weight, so ... who needs self-sealing fuel tanks, anyway, right? There's a ton more choices in here, but not enough room to write them down (without being too boring with the wall of text). Then, naturally, comes the war and battles, and you have to deploy the Squadrons to the airfields near the front lines and support your friendly troops / ships with reconnaisance, VIP transport, reconnaisance, bombing, reconnaisance, interdiction, reconnaisance, Close Air Support and occasional supply drop to the encircled troops - oh, and, did I mention reconnaisance? On top of which all comes the CAP and fighter sweeps and escorts and actual battle for air superiority - which is really just a sideshow for the more important part of your job of supporting your troops & ships, but hey - you can't support them if all your planes get instantly shot down, amirite? Anyway - it's just a distant dream of mine - 0.02$, really. Cheers!
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