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Post by swedewolf on Aug 11, 2019 3:42:22 GMT -6
Around 1930 Ive got some 30 prestige and toghether with US the first to get CVL and first to convert my BCs to 50 planes carriers. But when tension skyrocketed with Russia and Italia that have won easily before, the Kaiser started to deduct prestige points every turn because of they got more BBs and BCs. I build my first 2 purpuse build CVs and and had another 4 on the way when the war started with Italy. Sending down all my CVs and CVLs togheter with my few but extraordenary BBs. At this point my Prestige is down to 20 because of my jittery Kaiser. Havent lost a war so far mind you. Anyway, in first 3 fleet Battles I killed of Italys 2 CVLs but only sunk a single BC each battle but doing hvy damage on Italys hvy ships and sinking many many DDs. But in each battle I lose more Hvy ships than them. Because of (probably) all the heavies was under constant repair Italy was now blockaded. Helping was ofcource 10+ CLs raiding the Med. In my opinion, on my way to win this new modern naval war, Im down to 14 prestige. Also down 10k victory points as My CV screen(BBs and BCs) sunk giving Italy many points and my sweep of Italies DDs and 10+ damaged BBs and BCs dint gave me much. 2 strange convoy raids where I sunk the 2 merchants I needed to win, Italy got several 1000 points more than me because surviving Merchants on there side?! Anyway in my last fleet battle I lost my last 2 BBs and Italy lost some Heavies and again many Hvy and medium ships on the brink of sinking. Having 4 new CVs ready for next turn but My Kaiser Again took a prestige point from me and because of my 13 prestige fire me. Naming a coal hauler after me.  Had lots of fun anyway but havent got so worried Leader playing any nation and I played them all. Even Germany several times. Got some conclusions(thougts) after this time. 1: Do the Ministers, Kings, Kaiser etc got a random personality 2: Is the scoring not on PAR with modern naval battle? Is scoring still a RTW1 thing? 3: Still fun after a huge loss (according to game rules anyway) 4: Also played in Admiral Mod after trying Kaptains mode to try fire torpedoes on my own. Failing utterly as all my ships are oftenly in the way of eachother. Even when I tried with a sole CA. In the Admiral mod I never had a working screen. As all TF was locked into AI controll(except CVs ofcourse) so that can be the culprit why I losing VP as I had to be in the frontline with Flag TF. Making the attrition and charging OP DD launching torpedoes. About torpedoes, my side launched more torpedoes thou than in any other mod. So better torpedo frequense but lacking in screaning. |
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Post by fleet5 on Aug 11, 2019 5:37:49 GMT -6
Germany is the political hard mode since the Kaiser is hard to please, Germany has the bombastic head of state malus. Japan is the budget hard mode.
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Post by johnthegamer on Aug 11, 2019 9:24:33 GMT -6
My Kaiser kept bugging me about Britain having overwhelming superiority in Northern Europe, wanting me to do something about it. It's a good thing my prestige was pretty high from my war with France.
Britain had 3 times my budget and thus a lot more battleships (over 50 of them). What the hell does he expect me to do without more money? If you want more battleships, at least be prepared to pay for it, mr. Wilhelm.
What was even more annoying is that when I started building a bunch of new budget battleships to please him, he still kept complaining THREE times while they were under construction. I CAN'T JUST MAGIC THESE BATTLESHIPS OUT OF THIN AIR, YOU KNOW.
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Post by sloanjh on Aug 11, 2019 10:12:44 GMT -6
Apologies in advance if what I say below is stuff you already know; it sounds from your post that you've been playing in Captain's mode a lot and recently tried switching to Admiral and suffering from high attrition due to enemy DD torpedo runs.
I haven't played Captain (or even Rear Admiral) since my first few games of RTW1 several years ago, but based one what I've seen on the boards from Captain's players I suspect the styles are very different because of the control you have over torpedo attacks. My strategy is typically to build a smaller number of high quality BB and BC (longer ranged, heavier guns and heavier armor, especially on turrets) and keep the range open, especially with respect to torpedo range. I always make sure I have a torpedo range circle on my capital ships, and my doctrine is to jink every few minutes within range and not to get too close (especially if their DDs make a flotilla attack on me). It's when I violate doctrine that I get into trouble, both from torpedo hits and by the enemy (who usually outnumbers me) starting to get penetrating hits. So basically I'm using my flagship to control the range, mostly keeping it open.
This is one of the reasons that the (lack of a) Scouting Force bug is hitting me so hard - I've only got one tool (my flagship) to control the range rather than two - I usually have to put my BCs on "core" in order to keep them from engaging too closely and getting sunk. (Note that I also build heavily gunned, heavily armored BCs too - when I have scouting force this allows me to control the range against BB that they often outgun (in quality, not quantity). With a working scouting force, the BC are my primary offensive tools.)
In Captain's mode, on the other hand, it sounds like people use the ability to control DD divisions to drive their DD up to the opposing battle line and shoot them up with torpedoes. It sounds like (from your post) you are trying to use your flagship to force the DD to close on the enemy battle line, rather than using the "flotilla attack" button, which tells the DD to attack their line while you keep your battle line away from the enemy. This then subjects your battle line to torpedo fire from the enemy screening DD, leading to attrition of your capital ships. This is what I mean by different styles: I suspect that in Captain's mode the kill strategy is torpedoes fired manually from controlled DD divisions, while in Admiral's it's long range gunnery to slow down one or more ships (which then can be closed on and killed in isolation). Trying to use a heavy torpedo strategy in Admiral's is likely to give you big attrition from enemy torpedoes.
A few of more comments:
1) It might not sound like it above, but I agree completely about screening destroyers (and even CL and secondary batteries on BB) not seeming to do much good at preventing enemy DD squadrons from making effective torpedo runs, especially once torpedo range becomes long. Turning away from DDs that are vigorously closing (using the "turn together" button when necessary) is the only thing I know of that has a good chance of avoiding getting torpedoed.
2) The flotilla attack button can be very frustrating to use if you're counting on it as a fundamental part of your strategy - a lot of the time my DD just ignore it. It seems like it has the best chance of working when the enemy battle line is fairly deep within the torpedo envelope and trying to close vigorously (i.e. closer to a perpendicular than parallel course). It does seem to do a good job of (temporarily) driving off a superior pursuing enemy force. For example I've had a CA survive a (faster) BC encounter because it had a screen of several DD and I would use flotilla attack to get the DD to make torpedo feints and keep the BC from closing the range too much. For fleet battles, OTOH, it's been hit or miss for me whether I'll be in a position where flotilla attack will give me torpedo hits; I tend to use it as an "ok guys, the enemy are getting close so now's a good time if you want to make torpedo runs on them", i.e. a "permission to leave the screen and attack" button as opposed to a "required to attack" button.
3) One thing I haven't seen mentioned on the boards before: small DD are your force point friends! One of the downsides of a quality over quantity strategy is that you open yourself up to blockade, since force points are calculated using ship types, but not quality or tonnage. In other words, your 50kton super-BB with 12 guns is only worth 14 force points, in comparison with 28 force points for 2 small BB with 6 guns each. This can be mitigated by building lots of small DD. My 700 ton DD only cost ~$2.4 million and give one force point each, so 14 force points cost ~$35M. In contrast, my high end BB or BC can cost $160M for those 14 (or 12 for BC), so the DD are 4-5x more effective at generating force points to counter blockades and invasions than other ships. One thing to be cautious about if you use this strategy: these small DD are great as ASW platforms, but I strongly suspect that TP units' force points don't count for invasion strength calculations (in terms of keeping the enemy from invading you) and less strongly suspect they don't count for blockade calculations either. Note that (small) CL are also fairly effective as a cheap source of force points, and can also raid and protect from raiders, so they're another good option. I try to make my early CL high quality (max out 6" guns, and 3" armor) so that they can still be effective for several decades; even so they're only ~$20-25M for 4 points and so are only ~2x worse than DD.
John
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Post by cabalamat on Aug 11, 2019 18:05:46 GMT -6
My Kaiser kept bugging me about Britain having overwhelming superiority in Northern Europe, wanting me to do something about it. It's a good thing my prestige was pretty high from my war with France. Britain had 3 times my budget and thus a lot more battleships (over 50 of them). What the hell does he expect me to do without more money? If you want more battleships, at least be prepared to pay for it, mr. Wilhelm. What was even more annoying is that when I started building a bunch of new budget battleships to please him, he still kept complaining THREE times while they were under construction. I CAN'T JUST MAGIC THESE BATTLESHIPS OUT OF THIN AIR, YOU KNOW. What I comes up with the question "Government wants you to build 2 battleships / 8 cruisers / 15 destroyers" there should be a response "I'd be happy to if you'll give me the money to". |
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Post by tordenskjold on Aug 14, 2019 15:49:52 GMT -6
While I just came across to the idea "Well, you might get rid of the Kaiser by having a revolution happen", the question arose: Does a revolution affect this nation's disadvantage at all? Could as well be that the chancellor/general secretary/Führer is no less bombastic than the Kaiser...
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Post by JagdFlanker on Aug 14, 2019 15:58:07 GMT -6
While I just came across to the idea "Well, you might get rid of the Kaiser by having a revolution happen", the question arose: Does a revolution affect this nation's disadvantage at all? Could as well be that the chancellor/general secretary/Führer is no less bombastic than the Kaiser... i'm guessing, but if they give the 'no surrender' speech it might be a lot harder for your country to surrender regardless of your unrest - but for all i know only ai Führers give that speech |
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