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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 30, 2013 17:19:11 GMT -6
Well, there you are. I have met the enemy and he is mine! Great, love to blow things up. It was quite exhilarating, one division headed to starboard, one to port, one right down the middle. The transport attempting keep out of the line. Scattered the Chinese then proceeded to blow them out of the water. Will keep better cohesion next time, want to get them all. My next maneuver is the Trafalgar move, then I will try the Cup maneuver from Battle with the Spanish Armada in 1588. Avast, Me Hearties.
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Post by randomizer on Dec 30, 2013 17:44:16 GMT -6
Very cool, am sure Admiral Ito would be pleased. Thanks for the report.
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Post by phoenix on Dec 30, 2013 18:17:12 GMT -6
You have any pics of the action that you can post? Hard to 'see' it from your stats alone.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 30, 2013 18:37:50 GMT -6
You have any pics of the action that you can post? Hard to 'see' it from your stats alone. Sorry, not this go around, but I will try to remember to do some screen captures for you. It wasn't pretty like the text books, but I won.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 30, 2013 18:55:22 GMT -6
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 30, 2013 18:56:17 GMT -6
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 30, 2013 20:15:16 GMT -6
Third round of the Battle of Yalu River. Japanese Victory! (You expected anything less). I used my Balaklava Maneuver. Total points for the Victor, 41467. Seven Ships sunk, one heavily damaged, 1 medium damage. No losses on the Japanese side with light damage. Hit Count:
Japan - 6 heavy hits, 282 medium hits China - 1 heavy hit, 2 medium hit.
Now, it's Miller Time
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 30, 2013 22:59:13 GMT -6
I changed sides this time and played the Chinese. The Japanese gained a marginal victory with points almost even, I lost one DD but they did have some medium damage. I feel this was a good run because in the opposite side, I was able to sink anywhere from four to eight ships. As the Chinese, on my first run, I only lost one ship. I will study Chinese ships, firepower, speed and some intangibles in the Ship Design files and work on coordinating the fight better. I will have to devise some techniques.
On the next run, I will document and provide some results. My apologies. I am going to dig deeper into the books to find more information about the Chinese forces.
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Post by Fredrik W on Dec 31, 2013 2:32:25 GMT -6
Yes, the Yalu river is a fun scenario, and the Chinese flag is so cool it is certainly worth fighting under!
However, I should just add that the AI algorithms for tactical behaviour is made for a later era, so the battle will not play out as it did historically. The AI is simply not geared for using the formations of that era.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 31, 2013 8:56:46 GMT -6
Yes, the Yalu river is a fun scenario, and the Chinese flag is so cool it is certainly worth fighting under! However, I should just add that the AI algorithms for tactical behaviour is made for a later era, so the battle will not play out as it did historically. The AI is simply not geared for using the formations of that era. In this engagement, we must remember that the mission is to escort the merchant to its destination, not engage the Chinese Navy and fight a naval battle. To accomplish this, you have engage the Chinese, draw them to the SE and allow the merchant and its DD to slip by then disengage with the main division and ensure it arrives after that the Chinese fleet is all yours. On the other hand, for the Chinese its the opposite. You must stop that resupply mission by drawing the Japanese force away and using one of our smaller and faster divisions, strike the merchant and sink her. This should be your objective. As the Japanse, I saw none of that in the AI. The battle simply devolves into a melee which works well for the Japanese.
Keep in mind all, rarely in history, has a whole fleet been destroyed. Trafalgar and Tsushima were rarities. The naval action was always in support of land operations, either to eliminate guerre de course or maintain lines of communications for land operations. Navy's are still performing that function. Anti-piracy and protection of sea lanes are the primary goal, not large decisive naval engagement. Corbett was right, but Mahan seems to be partially wrong.
I noted that the lead Chinese Battleship has its two turrets up forward. This means it was meant to be the division leader and sail at the head, I've had difficulty finding the rest of the ships for the Chinese.
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Post by randomizer on Dec 31, 2013 9:44:35 GMT -6
Actually the Peiyang Fleet's escort mission was concluded the previous night and they were returning to Lushan (Port Arthur). The Japanese Combined Fleet commander intended to use the opportunity of the Chinese sortie to bring Ting's fleet to battle and the empty Chinese transports do not feature in any of the references that were consulted. The Japanese Naval Staff had anticipated the Chinese reinforcement of the eastern Liaotung Peninsula and deployed the fleet accordingly and successfully. VAdm Ito's mission was essentially annihilation of the Qing fleet to facilitate total sea control whereas the Chinese had successfully completed their escort mission and primarily just wanted to go home. This was the essential premise behind the scenario.
Thanks.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 31, 2013 10:42:29 GMT -6
Actually the Peiyang Fleet's escort mission was concluded the previous night and they were returning to Lushan (Port Arthur). The Japanese Combined Fleet commander intended to use the opportunity of the Chinese sortie to bring Ting's fleet to battle and the empty Chinese transports do not feature in any of the references that were consulted. The Japanese Naval Staff had anticipated the Chinese reinforcement of the eastern Liaotung Peninsula and deployed the fleet accordingly and successfully. VAdm Ito's mission was essentially annihilation of the Qing fleet to facilitate total sea control whereas the Chinese had successfully completed their escort mission and primarily just wanted to go home. This was the essential premise behind the scenario. Thanks. My source is "The China-Japan War Compiled from Japanese, Chinese and Foreign Source" by Zenone Volpicelli dtd 1896. It's a free book and Internet Archive will have it in PDF format and other formats. In this book, the battle is titled " Naval Battle of Hai-Yang Island". The narrative starts in Part III, the Campaign in China, Chapter 1, The Naval Battle of Hai-Yang Island. It does confirm what you have said and my sincere apologies.
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Post by randomizer on Dec 31, 2013 11:00:05 GMT -6
Please do not apologise, if I sounded harsh it was not intended as such and I really appreciate your ARR's and comments on the game.
All history is subjective and the absence of the now-empty Chinese transports from the scenario does not automatically mean that they were not a consideration in the event.
Thanks.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 31, 2013 11:40:02 GMT -6
Please do not apologise, if I sounded harsh it was not intended as such and I really appreciate your ARR's and comments on the game. All history is subjective and the absence of the now-empty Chinese transports from the scenario does not automatically mean that they were not a consideration in the event. Thanks. You weren't harsh and I did not take it as such. I am old man who spent forty years near and around the military, trust me, I am not real sensitive. You were correct, and I acknowledged that and did further research. Thanks and I will be playing the Chinese side some more today, I will provide some thoughts in my AAR. I am really getting to know the bells and whistles of the SAI system.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Dec 31, 2013 13:10:50 GMT -6
AAR 2nd Round of the Battle of the Yalu River as seen by the Chinese. This time I sent the left hand squadron SW under AI control. The other squadrons, once a sighting was effected, were turned to port, increased speed by two knots but attempted to maintain speeds the same. The Japanese AI continue to the right, as expected. I was not able to cross the T, but I wasn't actually trying. I did get heavy damage on the AMC and was awarded a marginal victory. Next time, I will repeat this maneuver, but will go to max speed on the slowest ship and match with the rest. This worked and my squadrons for most of the action stayed together. I need to work on this and course control in more detail. I will begin to provide actual course corrections numerically, it will be more precise.
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