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Post by rob06waves2018 on Dec 15, 2018 17:18:37 GMT -6
I do not remember if the rules of RTW provide something like this. If you collapse an enemy government, you can sometimes claim a ship as a war prize, adding it to your fleet. Whether or not you'll want to keep it in service is another question.
If you lose a war by governmental collapse, the computer can take a number of your ships, and the power which claimed them will use them for at least a little while.
I actually think that taking one ship is a little too arbitrary. For example, the German Fleet was to be completely handed over (but was scuttled - not the point). Perhaps if one takes a colony, one should get a ship and the greater the win, the more ships one is able to take. Also, one should be able to see the design of the ship to be taken.
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Post by bcoopactual on Dec 16, 2018 7:41:24 GMT -6
I don't want to get to far off of the topic on this thread because eventually I or someone else is going to have to go through it to generate the clean version of the thread. However, wars in RTW are different than what you see in WW1 and WW2. There isn't ever really any land war, outside of an event or two so there is no real total victory on the scale of the world wars. Even in WW1 where Germany was never invaded (by the Western Allies anyway) that fact is only true because they sued for peace and and the Allies agreed to an armistice if the Germans complied with their requirements, one of which was interning their fleet. The threat that the Allies could re-initiate the land war if the Germans didn't comply accomplished much the same thing as if Germany had been successfully invaded because they knew they lacked the capacity to stop the Allies by that point. So a limited war prize and some colonies seems pretty appropriate for winning a naval war even if it results in a collapse.
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Post by williammiller on Dec 31, 2018 12:22:17 GMT -6
Gents (and ladies) - this is a very useful thread, kudos to everyone who is contributing to it!
Let us please keep it on topic as much as possible, as I think it is a valuable resource for players both new and old. It might even inspire us (the NWS dev team) to include such a glossary with the game as a helpful tool
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Post by dorn on Dec 31, 2018 15:37:01 GMT -6
I am not technical guy, however I remember someone took a lot of notes Frederick wrote on this forum.
Question is, could we go further and create wiki for RTW. Is IT difficult to set up pages for that purpose?
I think there are a lot of people willing to contribute and such pages could easily give more information than manual. You can easily found something which is difficult found it somewhere written on this forum in past.
I would be first who would like to contribute even if as not native speaker there Will be need corrections.
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Post by bcoopactual on Dec 31, 2018 18:06:44 GMT -6
I have zero experience setting up or contributing to a Wiki but I would help however I could time allowing.
Intended topics for Weapons. Any topics in the weapons category that people want to see added?
Caliber - Internal diameter of a gun barrel and the diameter of the shell. Barrel length usually expressed as a multiple of the caliber.
In-game effects - Damage caused by shells that penetrate and explode (i.e. not a dud) is proportional to caliber and independent of gun quality.
Armor Piercing Shell - Heavy shell that features a thick, hardened steel wall at the expense of containing a relatively small bursting charge. Primarily used against heavily armored and peer opponents (i.e. light cruiser vs. light cruiser)
In-game effects - Best armor penetration of different shell types but lowest innate damage potential. Can pass through lightly armored and unarmored targets like destroyers prior to exploding.
High Explosive Shell - Relatively thin walled but with a much higher percentage of shell weight devoted to the explosive charge compared to AP shells. Sometimes referred to as High Capacity or Common shells. Used against unarmored and land targets.
In-game effects - Minimal armor penetrating capability but highest innate damage potential of all shell types. Shot that has the best chance of starting a fire in the target vessel. Optionally used in-game as the primary shot against armored targets in the 1900-1906 time frame due to the poor technological level of armor piercing shells of the time.
Semi-Armor Piercing Shell - Physically similar in layout and construction to the armor piercing shell but has a lighter shell wall and larger bursting charge compared to the equivalent armor piercing shell. Historically had roughly 3/4th the armor penetration of an armor piercing shell fired from the same gun.
In-game effects - Exact penetration values compared to equivalent AP shell are unknown. Intermediate damage potential between AP and HE shells.
AP Cap - Nose piece attached to the front of an AP shell's main body. Originally a relatively soft steel, German and Austro-Hungarian AP caps post 1911, British Greenboy caps and most post WW1 caps were made of hardened steel which work better than soft caps at oblique angles greater than 15-20%. AP caps absorbed the initial shock of impact with the hardened armor plate face allowing the main shell's nose and body to remain intact as it attempted to penetrate the plate.
In-game effects - Research topic in AP Projectiles. Provides gradual improvement to AP penetration.
Ballistic Cap - Long, pointy, cone shaped nose piece attached to the front of the shell body or AP cap (if installed) that provided improved aerodynamics. Extended the maximum range of the shell and minimized velocity losses due to air friction. Designed to detach on impact.
In-game effects - Research topic in AP Projectiles. Provides gradual improvement to AP penetration.
Super-Heavy Shells
Base Fuse
VT Fuse
Torpedo Hydrostatic Valve
Torpedo Gyroscope
Wet Heater Engine
Oxygen Torpedo
K-gun
Hedgehog
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Post by noshurviverse on Dec 31, 2018 20:39:32 GMT -6
I have zero experience setting up or contributing to a Wiki but I would help however I could time allowing. Intended topics for Weapons. Any topics in the weapons category that people want to see added? Since the purpose of the hypothetical RtWiki would be to give new players a basic idea of what they're dealing with in-game, I don't think getting into precise detail about individual weapon components is really needed. The average player doesn't really need to know how a hydro-static valve works or the difference between an AP and Ballistic cap.
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Post by abclark on Dec 31, 2018 22:58:50 GMT -6
I have zero experience setting up or contributing to a Wiki but I would help however I could time allowing. Intended topics for Weapons. Any topics in the weapons category that people want to see added? Since the purpose of the hypothetical RtWiki would be to give new players a basic idea of what they're dealing with in-game, I don't think getting into precise detail about individual weapon components is really needed. The average player doesn't really need to know how a hydro-static valve works or the difference between an AP and Ballistic cap. Why does it have to be limited to that? If it was a single document sure, but an actual wiki could be much more in-depth.
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Post by noshurviverse on Jan 1, 2019 2:12:59 GMT -6
Why does it have to be limited to that? If it was a single document sure, but an actual wiki could be much more in-depth. Well, at that point we're pretty much just copy-pasting Wikipedia itself, aren't we? I think the advantages of a Wiki is that it allows continuous updates and more detail about game concepts that otherwise wouldn't be feasible to fit in a single document and can be updated regularly. Of course, there are some things that can be a disadvantage with this format, at least from what I've seen with other game Wiki's. With anything that receives updates, the Wiki can get out of date, referencing past versions and unlike a dedicated manual stuff can get 'lost' and thus not updated. Another issue is that, if editing is open to the community or even a small team, there can be inconsistencies with page details. One article might give a detailed history of a concept and it's in-game application, while another might have almost nothing.
Of course, none of this should be taken as reason to not encourage a Wiki.
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Post by akosjaccik on Jan 1, 2019 9:09:33 GMT -6
A small addition, certainly, but I am gladly willing to help a bit with my non-professional, not top-notch, but fairly lenghty Paint Shop Pro expertise if the need arises to draw some illustrations and figures to help understand the subjects of the topic on whatever current or future manual / website.
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hanz
New Member
Posts: 9
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Post by hanz on Jan 1, 2019 9:20:37 GMT -6
A small addition, certainly, but I am gladly willing to help a bit with my non-professional, not top-notch, but fairly lenghty Paint Shop Pro expertise if the need arises to draw some illustrations and figures to help understand the subjects of the topic on whatever current or future manual / website. Hire this man.
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Post by bcoopactual on Jan 1, 2019 16:46:44 GMT -6
Intended topics for Armor and Defense
Face Hardening
Annealing
Homogeneous Armor
Inclined Armor
Internal Belt
Decapping
Splinter Deck
Torpedo Bulkhead
Longitudinal Framing
Double Bottom
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Post by akosjaccik on Jan 2, 2019 10:17:53 GMT -6
In the meantime I played around a bit with (mainly) the Solid Edge mechanical 3D modeling software and (for now, less so) the Paint Shop Pro. Mind you, these are just basic sketches "not intended for final use", though it isn't like I am capable of much more... I am absoultely not a graphic artist by trade by all means.
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Post by marauder on Jan 2, 2019 11:32:41 GMT -6
In the meantime I played around a bit with (mainly) the Solid Edge mechanical 3D modeling software and (for now, less so) the Paint Shop Pro. Mind you, these are just basic sketches "not intended for final use", though it isn't like I am capable of much more... I am absoultely not a graphic artist by trade by all means. Looks great so far!
I believe something like this would help some players who are new to or not familiar at all with warship armouring understand what they're doing in the ingame ship editor and why certain armour schemes behave like they do.
I know it would have helped me a bunch back when I started playing.
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Post by hrcak47 on Jan 2, 2019 14:42:50 GMT -6
I am happy that this topic started off so great. Love the 3d renders, I think they ought to be included in the game documentation proper.
Anyway, here's a bit of contribution from me.
Intended topics for Armor and Defense
Face Hardening - Face hardening involves adding more carbon the surface (face) of an armored plate. This, in turn, makes that surface harder and more effective against direct hits. Result is greater protection of a plate of armor for no increase in weight.
Harvey Armor - Most primitive way of achieving face hardening, called Harvey armor, was to burn coal on top of hot armor plates, a process known as carburization. The starting type of armor in RtW.
Krupp armor - Improvement of the face hardening technique, it involves the use of carbon bearing gasses under pressure instead of coal carburization. This allowed for better introduction of carbon to the steel, allowing for an armored plate with even greater "depth" of the hardened side, in turn being even more efficient for the same weight.
Krupp Cemented Armor - Specialized steel alloy even further optimized for Krupp process, it involves addition of chrome and nickel to the steel, then later gas carburized as Krupp armor.
Annealing - A process, where hardness of steel is purposefully decreased, in order to improve on its ductility. Ductile armor is soft and not good in stopping penetration, but it absorbs a lot of energy from an incoming shell.
Homogeneous Armor - A plate of armored steel, which has been forged and rolled while hot in order to homogenize the grain structure of the steel. This removes imperfections in the structure, creating for a stronger plate of armor.
Homogeneous Krupp Armor (Wotan or Special Treatment Steel Type B) - as above, but with Krupp process repeated after homogenizing. Steel best suited for decks and various armored bulkheads.
Inclined Belt - Weight saving technique which slightly inclines the armored belt. This lowers the volume protected by the belt, making the whole ship armor weigh less.
Internal Belt - Belt, protected by decapping plate. By protecting a smaller volume with the heavy main belt, the whole armor arrangement weighs less.
Decapping plate - A relatively thin plate of armor, placed in front of the main belt armor. Incoming shell would hit the decapping plate first, and blunt itself, as well as destabilizing itself. This makes it penetrate less upon hitting the actual belt.
Splinter Deck - Non penetrative, glancing hits can induce a lot of stress in the armored plate, which results in spalling, which are shards and fragments of steel flying from the opposite side of the hit armored plate. Splinter deck serves to absorb such spalling and protect the crew working below deck.
Torpedo Bulkhead - Longitudinal bulkheads made out of thin armor, which are designed to absorb the impact of the torpedo. Ship rich with torpedo bulkheads will be able to withstand more torpedo hits while remaining afloat. Longitudinal Framing - Traditional ships required a huge number of transverse beams, making them look like a ribcage. Longitudinal framing, or Isherwood process is a weight saving technique, where a ship requires much less of the transverse beams, while the ship is fortified by the addition of longitudinal beams connecting transverse beams. In the end, the ship is even more structurally sound, while weighing less.
Double Bottom - Additional bottom, which can help protect the ship from underwater explosions that would rip single bottomed hulls.
Triple Bottom - As above, even more secure.
Coal bunkers - Coal fueled ships store their coal in bunkers around the ship, which are cleverly placed to serve as additional protection. Coal does not explode, and coal bunkers can rather reliably absorb spalling and smaller hits. Coal bunkers can catch on fire, though.
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Post by akosjaccik on Jan 4, 2019 12:48:41 GMT -6
First and foremost, thank you for your feedback! As for now, I seriously should work on stuff, so uh... of course, I did some completely unrelated things instead. As I'd rather not spam the topic with my scribbles, just some links. I had some fun with this kind of format: Rangefinders, but ultimately my goal was to provide - hopefully - useful figures for any would-be manual, pdf, wiki or any kind of informational material for the players. Immediately a caveat, my native language is not english, and unfortunately it shows. My apologies for any errors in advance. Anyway, same idea ( Armor development ), may or may not get around to finish this sometime. I am aware however, that the only actually useful figure so far is of the coincidence rangefinder's, so next time I'll try to bring more stuff in that spirit. Edit: Oh, and if I did scr whatever I did screw up, feel free to point out!
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