Convince me to buy RJW

[rosseau]

S&I and expansion is wonderful package at $55. But I'm having a hard time justifying $35 more for RJW. Not familiar or particularly interested in this period of naval warfare. Plus, I already have the battle generator, world map from S&I.

So what more am I getting for $35? Old BB's and a new campaign?

Either way, glad for your success with the series. It is richly deserved and dev support is outstanding.

Best to you,

Mike

[fredsanford]

If you buy RJW, Randomizer will come to your house and wash your car and cut the grass. Maybe even take you out for pizza.

[rosseau]

I would not want to distract him from work on the WWII version I'm sure is being planned!

[Matto]

I have similar problem ... I have RJW and looking if buy S&I and Campaign expansion for 55$ ...

[randomizer]

Rosseau wrote:

So what more am I getting for $35? Old BB's and a new campaign?

I'm biased so my advice is to look around, read and decide.  There are gunnery resolution and doctrinal changes that are applicable to the RJW era but not to the Great War.  Things are slower, ranges are shorter, fleets are smaller and for the campaign the theatre is considerably bigger than the North Sea and the strategic situations for both sides are different from each other and from WW1.

However do not hold your breath waiting for car washes or lawn cutting if you do take the plunge, sorry.  Besides, pub-grub always trumps pizza unless the latter is home-made.

Either way, glad for your success with the series. It is richly deserved and dev support is outstanding. 

Thanks for the support, Mike.

Matto wrote:

I have similar problem ... I have RJW and looking if buy S&I and Campaign expansion for 55$

More campaigns, more scenarios and the entire naval Great War in the North Sea and Baltic.  But as written above, I am biased so don't take my word alone.

Thanks.

[rosseau]

Matto, the upside for you would be lots of new ships and mods with S&I. It is also been tweaked to near perfection. And you don't really need the campaign expansion, so just $35.

[Matto]

What I love on S&I RJW is combination of ships, scenario generator and a campaign ... so by is without campaign expansion is not way for me ...
But I cannot find any AAR from full war campaign here on the forum, so I cannot imagine differences. How many OP have both sides in one week full war scenario turn?

[randomizer]

But I cannot find any AAR from full war campaign here on the forum, so I cannot imagine differences

Here's a link to forum Member Cleveland's Baltic AAR:

SAI Baltic AAR

Here is a North Sea Campaign as Germany posted on the Armchair General's forum:

Armchair General AAR

In the North Sea campaign the RN usually receives over 200 OP per weekly turn and the German's somewhat fewer.  Large operations are possible, the British have a Room-40 intelligence advantage and the German's have fixed zeppelin search zones covering much of the North Sea by 1916.  There are four campaigns:

Baltic Sea - Russia vs. Germany August 1914 to December 1916
North Sea - RN vs. HSF August 1914 to November 1918
North Sea Germany Stronger - Reinforced HSF (the historically uncompleted late war ship programmes are included as reinforcements) vs. the RN (which gets a couple of Hood's as compensation) January 1916 to November 1918
North Sea 1916 - Historical RN vs. HSF February 1916 to November 1918

German U-Boat availability varies since they will often be tasked to commerce warfare and so be unavailable to the Player.  The Objectives are generally Reach, Bombardment or Minelaying for the Germans and Mine laying, Reach or Sink for the British.  The British may receive Reach objectives for their seaplane carriers (AV's) and success triggers an air raid on a target ashore provided it's reached in daylight and the weather is suitable to launch the planes.  There is trade in the North Sea that the German's can attack (and even the odd blockade runner for the RN to catch) and the RN's blockading forces (which become significant as the War continues) are outside Player control but vulnerable to attack.  Eventually there will be convoys to Scandinavia and the US battle squadron will show up.

The German Player cannot change the course of the War, victory in the game is entirely based on the naval situation alone and eventually the German Fleet (and the Russian fleet in the Baltic campaign) will begin to see unrest, morale decline and mutiny.

Thanks.

[Matto]

Great, thanks for nice summary and informations about campaigns, which I did not find anywhere ...
I read SAI Baltic here, but no AAR on Amrchair General forum ... I will do it and I will see

Thanks again !

[kasuga]

Buy it or Mr Dicaprio is going to work on your legs




More serious now... RJW is a game to explore a period where ships were more "unicum" fights are similar but diferent at same time to SAI battles... apart this you have other minor nations to cover pre 1904 war and you can have interesting fights.

Maybe you can wait a little and see more info about game but if you dont have more buys in mind and you like SAI RJW is a good option.

[dickturpin]

I would suggest the following reasons may be considered:

Why go for naval wargames in the late C19 and early C20?

There are two reasons as far as I can see; the first being that you find this interesting for its own sake or because it is the wargames period par excellence.

Much of military history is set in periods of slow technological change and the militaries of the respective nations remain rather constant and similar over time. In common with say land warfare in the 1490’s – 1550’s or the 1930’s, this is a period of rapid technological change in which you find varying theories of design and employment of the different kinds of warship; you thus find a rather experimental and varied (and thus interesting) range of different ships with different capabilities and potential roles.

From a wargames perspective, most players want to fight battles and take the role of the great captains of history. I don’t think anyone has yet solved the conundrum of creating land battles with 10’s or 100’s of thousands of participants and thus games are scaled down to a few hundred participants and this presents practical issues with respect to recreation of a battlefield (were say a farmhouse equates to a scaled small town). With naval battles, you can represent a fleet with a fleet in 1:1 scale and fight a battle as it was actually fought. There is a short window between the complexities of wind powered sailing ships and the complexities of battlefields dominated by aircraft which allows for the more accessible and manageable combat between steam powered ships armed with gun and torpedo.

Why go for NWS?

So far as I am aware, there is only one other manufacturer that covers this period for PC; whilst their games look rather nice (and are quite expensive) there are quite a few issues with bugs and they have not really been supported over the last few years. As far as I am concerned, the NWS titles are much superior in their reflection of history and the different capabilities and roles of different types of warship are done in a realistic way (eg. battleships, cruisers and torpedo craft can all be used realistically and reflect the relevant strengths and limitations of the original vessel). In addition, to the extensive range of scenarios, random battles and campaigns, there is the facility to design your own ships and create your own scenarios. I am a total philistine when it comes to technology but even I can mod the games; I am currently playing WW1 North Sea Campaign with the entire Channel Fleet and all the German reserve warships added (along with my own versions of the constituent ships and OP’s to suit my interpretation).

In terms of the number of hours I have spent playing these games, they represent very good value for money; the difficulties involved in stopping playing have probably saved me a fortune in the other games that I have not purchased!!

Why get all the titles?

This is an easy one as they are all different and enable you to experience the various aspects of naval warfare. Original S&I gives you the dreadnoughts and in Jutland, the largest big gun fleet battle of all time. In addition to the content of the original game, you can cover any scenario that you can think up between say 1910 and the early 1920’s anywhere in the world.

The campaign expansion is probably the most ambitious game that I have ever seen. The North Sea game is massive in scope and you also get to play the Baltic. Both campaigns have differing challenges for the different protagonists and you thus get to play 4 different campaigns each lasting circa 4 years each.

The RJW is very much different to WW1 both in terms of ships and the strategic situation. One of the limitations with the historical setting of WW1 is that it does not allow for cruiser warfare but this is covered in the RJW. Once again, the 2 campaigns are different from each other and present different challenges to WW1. What is rather intriguing with this period is the recreation of the older ships; there are quite a variety of turret ships, barbette ships, central citadel types, central battery types which were in commission during this period and figure to a limited extent in the campaign or scenarios. Presumably these can be recreated through the ship editor (I have made a number of them already) and represent a treasure trove of alternative scenarios to create. Personally, I am hoping for an expansion or similar in this period but if not, I am keeping my fingers crossed for a campaign editor.

[rosseau]

Thank you all for the additional input. I bought S&I and Expansion as soon as they came out. That was before this excellent review was published, which I hope you have linked from your site - Don't be too modest

wargamer.com/article/3179/pc-game-review-steam-and-iron-a-second-look

I've only fiddled with the game, but once I dig deeper, I'm sure RJW will be more appealing. I need to learn more about the period - without buying books more expensive than the game itself!

I have SAS-WW2, but again, time is the enemy. Anyway, congrats again on a near-perfect naval game that replaces graphics fluff with the real stuff!

[Matto]

So I bought it, unfortunately at Friday evening, so I must wait until Monday ... my fault

... just got it, great !!!

[Matto]

... and I'm really satisfied ... it is great. I started All war campaign in the North Sea like British ... played about 8 turns (weeks), fight two bigger battles, sunk one enemy BB and some cruisers and destroyers and have only damaged BB and BC (but about 10 ... two were torpedoed near Helgoland ... it was long way to safe harbour ))

[randomizer]

Mar 9, 2014 11:28:03 GMT -6 Matto said:

... and I'm really satisfied ... it is great. I started All war campaign in the North Sea like British ... played about 8 turns (weeks), fight two bigger battles, sunk one enemy BB and some cruisers and destroyers and have only damaged BB and BC (but about 10 ... two were torpedoed near Helgoland ... it was long way to safe harbour ))

Glad you're enjoying the game!

Thanks.