gb
New Member
Posts: 28
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Post by gb on Oct 13, 2013 9:21:41 GMT -6
Are we lost all the discussions of the old NWS forum? Is there a way to see them? Thanks gb
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Post by William Miller on Oct 13, 2013 12:32:37 GMT -6
Are we lost all the discussions of the old NWS forum? Is there a way to see them? Thanks gb Sorry but no.. the old forums are trashed. Long story.. but we had very good reason to move away from VB style forums.
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Post by julianbarker on Oct 13, 2013 13:01:18 GMT -6
So the custom SAI scenarios are lost as well?
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Post by randomizer on Oct 13, 2013 13:13:30 GMT -6
So the custom SAI scenarios are lost as well? After the next update is released I intend to redo all the scenarios that I created using the newest executable and upload onto this forum as they're completed. Hopefully the tweaked new versions will be improvements over the originals. However, this may take some time as work continues on the RJW.
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gb
New Member
Posts: 28
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Post by gb on Oct 13, 2013 14:37:28 GMT -6
Are we lost all the discussions of the old NWS forum? Is there a way to see them? Thanks gb Sorry but no.. the old forums are trashed. Long story.. but we had very good reason to move away from VB style forums. Very bad news, thank you very much in every case for your work on SAI.
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Post by julianbarker on Oct 13, 2013 15:29:09 GMT -6
Good news on the custom scenarios. Looking forward to the new versions when they appear. Hope the Last Sorte is adapted to reflect the German plans (witch are available online) rather than the erroneous raid on the Norway convoys presented in the scenario published. I had a go at it myself, but it was to large for my fledgling scenario designer skills.
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Post by randomizer on Oct 13, 2013 22:58:28 GMT -6
The stock The Last Sortie scenario takes some licence with the events but a truly historical scenario would not result in any action at all. Placing Hercules' division at sea and forming the Grand Fleet into two forces, the battle fleet and the battle cruiser fleet represent two of the significant differences from the actual operation. Accurately reproducing the German plan also leads to the problem that no convoys were in positions where they could be located by Hipper and SG2.
I have four custom versions of this general situation including one built from scratch in July 1918 when RAdm Rodman's 6BS started covering the Methil-Bergen convoys. My principle sources are Marder, Kennedy and Scheer. There are others of course but non-battles do not tend to attract that much attention. You have me thinking that perhaps it might be worth polishing up the USN scenario for release.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Oct 14, 2013 9:53:51 GMT -6
Sorry but no.. the old forums are trashed. Long story.. but we had very good reason to move away from VB style forums. Very bad news, thank you very much in every case for your work on SAI. Ok, lessons learned. Now, is it advisable to have an offsite storage for custom scenarios and anything that might need to be retrieved later. You can use an old computer and simply have a backup storage. When I ran servers for the US Navy, I had an offsite storage facility in San Diego, for just this problem. It might be possible to do this with minimum expenses.
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Post by Fredrik W on Oct 14, 2013 14:57:52 GMT -6
Good news on the custom scenarios. Looking forward to the new versions when they appear. Hope the Last Sorte is adapted to reflect the German plans (witch are available online) rather than the erroneous raid on the Norway convoys presented in the scenario published. I had a go at it myself, but it was to large for my fledgling scenario designer skills. The Last Sortie scenario was designed more with playability and what might have happened in mind than strictly following what actually did happen. If you have a good online resource for additional information I will be happy to check it out to see if there is anything that should be changed, so please post a link.
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Post by julianbarker on Oct 14, 2013 15:08:42 GMT -6
The wikipedia article contains the full text of the German imperial order for the operation which was a raid on the channel seeing up a final battle of the Dutch Coast using a large sub trap with 30 Uboats. What I would like to create would be the battle the order envisions, but don't have enough practise with the scenario designer to achieve. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_order_of_24_October_1918
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Post by Fredrik W on Oct 14, 2013 15:59:56 GMT -6
Ok, I see now it is a case of misunderstanding. The scenario The Last Sortie covers the attempted attack on the Norwegian convoys in April 1918, which was the last time the HSF really sortied in force, not the planned sortie that ended in mutiny in late 1918. Though I do understand the title might be somewhat misleading, and it could equally well have referred to the later aborted sortie.
The latter plan might very well warrant a scenario, I will see if I have the time to make it sometime.
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Post by randomizer on Oct 14, 2013 16:59:36 GMT -6
I have already built and tested a scenario based on the aborted October channel operation of the HSF and it is really not very much fun from the German side since my aim was to be as accurate as possible in modelling the probable situation. The HSF pretty much gets slaughtered, taking losses passing through the successive lines of RN submarines and then transiting the assorted defensive minefields laid and maintained for years with just such an operation in mind. In daylight the RN forces in the Channel tend to avoid decisively being engaged and during the long Autumn night, the many DD's of the Harwich Force can be deadly. Barring the way home is a Grand Fleet that is vastly superior even when leaving most of the 12" gunned dreadnoughts at home. It can easily absorb losses from the U-Boat trap and still retain enough firepower to annihilate Hipper's fleet.
By October 1918 there were no worthy objectives for a naval advance into the Channel and the destruction of the Fleet would have been an outrageously futile gesture. The crews knew it, whether through common sense or instinctively and hence the mutiny.
Just my opinions.
@ FW - It's been quite a while since I worked on this but I can shine it up and send it to you if you like.
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Post by julianbarker on Oct 15, 2013 0:30:48 GMT -6
I agree the operation is likely to pan out like that, but it seemed to me there is the opportunity to model day two onwards with all going to the German plan.
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Post by vonfriedman on Nov 18, 2013 8:54:52 GMT -6
In Marder I read that in 1918 most of the big british shells were of a new enhanced type, that would have gone through the german armor, exploding inside their ships. If this is correct, it should be included into the simulation, making the german operation even more similar to a suicide mission.
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Post by williammiller on Nov 18, 2013 9:21:29 GMT -6
In Marder I read that in 1918 most of the big british shells were of a new enhanced type, that would have gone through the german armor, exploding inside their ships. If this is correct, it should be included into the simulation, making the german operation even more similar to a suicide mission. You are referring to what the RN called the "Greenboy" shells. IIRC the simulation does model shell reliability and takes that into account.
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