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Post by brygun on Oct 14, 2020 18:29:33 GMT -6
Summary:
Give fighters the ability to sent to a navigation point to patrol. Maybe the "escort" mission does this but I'm not sure and the name implies being around other planes.
Situation:
1933 in a battle with very damaged BB, BC and CA. I have 2 of 80 plan CVs flying off their planes. Enemy has lost their convoy, their BB/BC are sunk, sinking or being torpedo so aren't pursuing. The enemy does have a CVL that is sending out air attacks (and possibly land attacks could occur). To avoid losing any major capital ship I want to send out fighters on a barrier patrol along the flight route of the enemy planes seem to be using.
The modern navy has "Barrier Cap" BARCAP that does this. Where airplane fighters are stationed along a route. This is not necessarily near our ships. It can be often in blocking likely bomber routes. This is more important in the missile age where airplane surface to surface missiles have long ranges making it desirable to have your fighters to engage them outside of the ranges they could fire on your ships with. Its not the only fighter assignment as you probably want a few planes close in.
Even in 1930s and 1940s a BARCAP real world might force the enemy to drop fuel tanks or even better their bombs making them unable to continue to their targets.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Oct 14, 2020 21:22:10 GMT -6
Actually, there have been many *cap types besides Barrier CAP. There was BATCAP, DADCAP, MIGCAP,RESCAP, TARCAP and FastCAP; just to name a few.
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Post by brygun on Oct 14, 2020 22:27:07 GMT -6
Actually, there have been many *cap types besides Barrier CAP. There was BATCAP, DADCAP, MIGCAP,RESCAP, TARCAP and FastCAP; just to name a few. Perhaps in one of the lore portions of the forums you can go into more detail on those. Suffice to say there are a lot of "plane patrols this area" missions that aren't "escort". I also started thinking the patrol order might need 2 or 3 options for duration. Sometimes you want the planes there only a short time, like covering a retreat of ships, while others you want them a very long time. Patrol_30 = Patrol set location for 30 minutes, fuel permitting Patrol_60 Patrol = Patrol a set location for 60 minutes fuel permitting Patrol_RTB = Patrol until low on fuel However we don't fully model fuel levels on planes so maybe the 30/60 minute settings are enough. |
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Post by oldpop2000 on Oct 15, 2020 7:26:48 GMT -6
Actually, there have been many *cap types besides Barrier CAP. There was BATCAP, DADCAP, MIGCAP,RESCAP, TARCAP and FastCAP; just to name a few. Perhaps in one of the lore portions of the forums you can go into more detail on those. Suffice to say there are a lot of "plane patrols this area" missions that aren't "escort". I also started thinking the patrol order might need 2 or 3 options for duration. Sometimes you want the planes there only a short time, like covering a retreat of ships, while others you want them a very long time. Patrol_30 = Patrol set location for 30 minutes, fuel permitting Patrol_60 Patrol = Patrol a set location for 60 minutes fuel permitting Patrol_RTB = Patrol until low on fuel However we don't fully model fuel levels on planes so maybe the 30/60 minute settings are enough. I can start a thread in the military history forum if you want or just explain them here briefly. |
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Post by oldpop2000 on Oct 15, 2020 9:33:30 GMT -6
Here is some brief information about combat air patrols.
The combat air patrol's main task was to break up attacking bomber formations but not to shoot them down. Bombers generally fly in very tight formations for mutual support for their gunners. However, once the fighters attacked they would break up and this made them easier to shoot down with AA fire and more combat air patrols. The evolution of combat air patrols started at the beginning of the war. For the US Navy, the planes were about 25 miles in the direction the enemy formation would be coming in to the fleet. The fighters would be stationed over the fleet. There would be at least two layers. One layer down low to defend against torpedo bombers and the other depending the weather at about 15,000 to 20,000 feet. You can use dive bombers for the inner patrol against submarines and against the torpedo bombers. It would be best to have two squadrons of them.
Of course, CAP works best with air search radar and a dedicated fighter control system in place. With two carriers together, one can be the day carrier which means it handles the CAP and fighter direction. Time aloft depends on the range of the aircraft, but 2-3 hours is normal. Generally its best to have a second flight of four fighters on the deck ready to launch at a moment's notice if the enemy aircraft are spotted.
I have no idea if the game duplicates this. The Japanese and British did things a little different. The Japanese did not have radar to help and the British did not have large airwings.
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Post by potrero on Oct 17, 2020 1:16:23 GMT -6
There really needs to be some way to quickly establish CAP to protect your surface action groups.
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Post by brygun on Oct 17, 2020 14:09:45 GMT -6
There really needs to be some way to quickly establish CAP to protect your surface action groups. Two in game already though not quite like I suggested 1) order planes to "escort" at a target near your ships, though the planes have to fly there, and what is "escort" if there are no other planes? 2) carrier groups when you bring up the status/orders screen the carrier groups have an option to "send cap to" But yes... Not entirely sure if these would do BARCAP (and other caps) This one of my concerns for the game mechanic into the cold war age. For instance even getting into late WW2 fighter groups could be radio'd to change direction to provide CAP elsewhere. Certainly into the missile age that the game now has you could redirect scattered small fighter patrols to challenge a large bomber force approaching, once you knew where they would come from. |
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