|
Post by pratapon51 on Nov 27, 2022 2:22:05 GMT -6
I was intrigued after I recently learned the Big E (CVN-65) did, in fact, have belt armor of approx. 8" aluminum plate.
It made me wonder - is alumin(i)um going to be something usable as an option in RTW3? By the 1970s, we would start to see ships built with aluminum superstructures and possibly more.
|
|
|
Post by avimimus on Nov 29, 2022 19:52:57 GMT -6
It'd be interesting if RTW IV had an option to select the type of armour as well as the thickness (with different types of armour having different resistance tables and cost tables).
One could do something similar with different types of gun (e.g. muzzle loader, solid vs. explosive shells) separate from quality and size.
It'd allow pushing the game back into the 1870s!
|
|
|
Post by wlbjork on Nov 29, 2022 22:17:39 GMT -6
We might find an armour selection scheme entering play with RtW3, as pre-Harvey armour there were several types of armour available, none of them really exceptional.
|
|
|
Post by williammiller on Nov 30, 2022 11:25:40 GMT -6
I was intrigued after I recently learned the Big E (CVN-65) did, in fact, have belt armor of approx. 8" aluminum plate. It made me wonder - is alumin(i)um going to be something usable as an option in RTW3? By the 1970s, we would start to see ships built with aluminum superstructures and possibly more. We are discussing the merits/drawbacks of aluminum SS in our internal threads right now...
|
|
|
Post by pratapon51 on Dec 1, 2022 13:13:19 GMT -6
Nice!
I'd probably give it a significant weight saving bonus and a slight bonus to maintenance cost (doesn't rust!), but lower SS damage and fire resistance. Using the Boston-class and Albany-class CG conversions as inspiration, it should also be something that can be changed in a rebuild.
Long term, such structures might incur fatigue cracking problems but that's probably outside of RTW's scope.
|
|
|
Post by wlbjork on Dec 1, 2022 23:56:11 GMT -6
Ah, but don't forget the downside of aluminium: It's not as strong per unit thickness as steel, which means you'll need to consider if the protection offered will be adequate.
Also, don't be too worried about aluminium flammability. The Royal Navy assessment post-Falklands was that this had no effect on ship damage/losses.
|
|
|
Post by pratapon51 on Dec 2, 2022 6:31:27 GMT -6
Not sure yet if we'd be allowed to use it as armor directly! But a separate 'superstructure' armor level would be nice if things were going to get that granular.
And yeah, it's a bit overstated, but I kind of like it having a slight difference in flammability. Although AShMs as implemented in game are already extremely fire-deadly...
|
|
|
Post by perfectpastrami on Jan 11, 2023 11:26:26 GMT -6
Ah, but don't forget the downside of aluminium: It's not as strong per unit thickness as steel, which means you'll need to consider if the protection offered will be adequate. Also, don't be too worried about aluminium flammability. The Royal Navy assessment post-Falklands was that this had no effect on ship damage/losses. Honestly, if it means squeezing enough displacement for an extra knot or two (or maybe another missile launcher) out of a cheap destroyer, that would be a tradeoff i'd make.
|
|
|
Post by williammiller on Jan 12, 2023 12:59:18 GMT -6
The option to build using aluminum construction (mainly of the superstructure) is now in the latest RTW3 internal betas :-)
|
|
|
Post by archelaos on Jan 22, 2023 8:59:55 GMT -6
And yeah, it's a bit overstated, but I kind of like it having a slight difference in flammability. Although AShMs as implemented in game are already extremely fire-deadly... While aluminum may not burn, it will melt eagerly - just look at photos of burned out BMDs. Their aluminum hulls at some point start to flow like a wax while steel turrets mostly keep shape. Safe to say, if I was on a warship, I would prefer it's floating structure to be steel...
|
|
|
Post by oldpop2000 on Jan 22, 2023 11:46:33 GMT -6
One caveat about the use of aluminum. It requires bauxite ore which is hydrated aluminum oxide (60%) mixed with silca and iron oxide. It requires 4 to 5 tons of bauxite to produce 2 tons of aluminum. Not every nation has access to this material.
Australia, China, Guinea, Brazil and India are the current largest producers. The US was an important source in the early 20th century but now only supplies one percent of the world's production.
This needs to be factored into the equation. If you don't have this natural resource, then you will have to trade for it and that complicates your naval strategy. Enjoy.
|
|
|
Post by williammiller on Jan 22, 2023 11:53:06 GMT -6
Fires will (in general) cause more damage onboard a ship with an aluminum superstructure due to the materials lower melting temperature and lower strength when heated, so such ships are/were/will be more vulnerable to fires.
|
|
|
Post by oldpop2000 on Jan 22, 2023 12:10:21 GMT -6
Fires will (in general) cause more damage onboard a ship with an aluminum superstructure due to the materials lower melting temperature and lower strength when heated, so such ships are/were/will be more vulnerable to fires. Yup, Aluminum melts at 1220 degrees F, Carbon steel at 2597-2800 degrees farenheit.
|
|
|
Post by navalperson on Jan 28, 2023 16:04:26 GMT -6
Fires will (in general) cause more damage onboard a ship with an aluminum superstructure due to the materials lower melting temperature and lower strength when heated, so such ships are/were/will be more vulnerable to fires. With fire playing a larger role in ships with aluminum super structures. Are we possibly going to see the potential addition of ships around a burning ship helping with fire fighting?
|
|
|
Post by oldpop2000 on Jan 28, 2023 22:04:06 GMT -6
In 1975, the USS Belknap collided with the USS John F. Kennedy during night operations off of Sardinia. The fire razed the Belknap's superstructure to the main deck. Seven sailors dies on the Belknap. It was the time between the Belknap's repair and the sudden cracking on the Oliver Hazard Perry Frigates that the Navy reverted back to steel on many classes of ships.
After the OHP frigates, the Navy has continued with steel superstructures.
|
|