Ships Parts for Everybody

[jwsmith26]

Oct 27, 2016 16:09:16 GMT -6 ccip said:

Oct 27, 2016 11:38:56 GMT -6 jwsmith26 said:

It would be great to see this included organically in the game, but for the RTW team using these images would probably cause some copyright issues. That's not a big deal for the end user, but for a company making profit (what little there is ;-) it could be an issue. Providing some level of support for using these types of images, without actually including them in the game, would probably be acceptable. 

Actually, I've looked into this, and this should not be a problem - all the sources I used (which are from archive.org) are public-domain. In fact the reason my latest source is the 1923 annual is that it's the cutoff publication date for public domain in the US right now. They're public domain in Britain as well from what I was able to gather.

I also shouldn't underplay my own input into these either, because as I said, a very large part of it had to be redrawn/recombined to the point of being only "kind of like" the original. And as I've been going further into this, I'm going more and more down the path that galagagalaxian suggested, because I find that drawing small parts from scratch makes for much better results. Big, simple shapes copy over well, but small stuff with so many pixels to work with is really hard to shrink down. Ironically, some of the smallest parts have been taking me the longest time to do!

I'll check with Fredrik if he's interested, after these are in a ready form
And if there's still concerns, well, I can always redraw some of the parts that are actually direct copies!

That's excellent news, ccip. I fully appreciate the amount of work required to massage old images into something usable in a game. It's a labor of love, sometimes quite painful love.

I think one of the main constraints for the RTW team is creating graphic content, but by making this interface available to the players they opened up the game to let players fill that gap, which you guys have done beautifully.

[ccip]

Thanks, appreciate it as always!

Oct 27, 2016 18:04:16 GMT -6 galagagalaxian said:

Well, I'm certainly looking forward to it. It'll let me create an even better (and more period appropriate) version of the "Goon's Warships Annual" pages I made for a Let's play/AAR I'm writing on the Something Awful forums (several people in the RtW thread there also think this stuff is amazing and have loved the other stuff put out in this thread so Nunos, CCIP, others, rest assured, your effort is being enjoyed).
 
Bigger Versions: Pg1 Pg2

And wow, you goons are sure not sparing effort and creativity on this game, nicely done!



Meanwhile, working on cruisers today, coming along slowly...









And a question for those who've edited some of these files before:



Does anyone know where that little vertical line I've circled comes from?

I know it's in a file somewhere (since it changes colour depending on set), but so far I haven't had any luck isolating it.

[ccip]

Cruisers are done (of the first, early-era set that is), complete with new funnels and more clearly distinguished bows, so you can now build the likes of this ram-beast:



As you can see, for this set they're all set up with a deck-only, protected cruiser configuration.





And work on destroyers has started - again, these are meant for the early set, so they're all based on turn-of-the-century TB/TBDs :



The trouble is that Brassey's, of course, only includes capital ships - so I had to draw up all these guys from scratch. Hopefully these do an adequate job! And though the hulls are more or less done, I don't yet have much in the way of masts or superstructure that's compatible with them yet - which I suppose will be my next thing to tackle.




Also worth mentioning that the DD images do make for some silly-looking 200t minesweepers!
Not really something that can be changed much, though, since they use the same files as the DDs.





So, all the auto-generating parts are done - just gotta get a few more accessories together, and I'll have a first set ready to play with

[galagagalaxian]

I didn't realize Brassey's didn't include Torpedo Boat Destroyers, how odd. What about Jane's for destroyers?

[galagagalaxian]

I have no idea if any of this will prove useful, but here is a few decent photos and side views of destroyers from around 1900-1905.

imgur.com/a/NnxbL

Most Torpedo Boat Destroyers at that point had those signature "turtledeck" prows, though I think the Americans dropped it pretty quickly. Most of the British-origin and some from other nations TBDs also have a pretty standout "bandstand" (as I think it was called) platform the forward 3"/12 pounder would be mounted on.

[ccip]

Thanks, that does help



I was actually using some of the same images for reference, but especially based on the photos, I tweaked the boats just a little - it's still tricky to reconcile the "turtleback" look with the gun positions the game puts in (so that you don't end up with guns being in the air or inside the hull), but at least I mostly got it into 3 of the 4 options for the DD look.



Here's a typical 500t DD generated out of the editor now (with no accessories etc. put on)

[edit] Actually, wait a second... I think I got this! 

(pictures removed, new ones in as replacement below)

[ccip]

Aha, I think I have it - here's my new attempt, with the forward bandstand (built into the gun drawing):


(no raised forecastle)



(raised forecastle: whaleback)



(raised forecastle: short)



(raised forecastle: long) - that's the one I'm keeping with the more modern ocean-going bow.

[ccip]

Continuing apace, although work during the week keeps me busy

I should have something very soon - virtually all the parts for the first set are ready, now it's a matter of organizing, cleaning up, and redrawing where necessary. The number of sets I'll have to create is growing already - I've found that my DD layout messes up the gun placement on cruisers (if they have unarmored turrets), while both MS and AMC use the "destroyer" hulls, meaning neither ends up being drawn correctly. What I think I will end up doing for this is shuffling my sets around a bit - either creating a couple more new sets for specific kinds of ships, or just reshuffling the organization a little - I'll need at least one set for auxiliary ships (AMC/MS), one for early TBs/TBDs under which I can also stick small, low-profile cruisers and avisos, and one perhaps later one where I can have DDs/DLs and small scout cruisers.




Over 100 masts already, as you can see
Lattice masts are a pain! Those last 2 I actually had to redraw by hand, and at that scale they still look rather messy/pixely.


**

And a quick question for those of you who care about this sort of thing: 

You'll see that in the current mast sets above, I have a lot of them right now that are combined with superstructures.
What do YOU prefer:

1) Combined masts and superstructures (filed under "masts etc.")
2) Combined masts and superstructures (filed under "superstructure")
3) Separate masts and separate superstructures (so you can combine them yourself)
4) A mix of both separate and combined ones

I personally prefer 1) for the most part because it's quicker and because "masts" is the first menu in the profile editor customization screen, but I'm open to any other suggestions - gotta organize this all somehow

[garrisonchisholm]

This all looks amazing! I can't wait until DL'ing everything is less cumbersome. As is, I prefer option 1 as well ccip.

[ccip]

Cheers! Moving along with it - today was an experimental kind of day and I worked on those AMCs and minesweepers (after realizing I'd have to split off early TBDs into a different set). Again, since those are not in Brasseys - ended up getting lots of reference and drawing something that looked approximately correct. 



Since I wanted to have the option of generating both AMCs and basic MSs out of the same set of images, I had to resort to a few compromises and trickery... but all in all, it works surprisingly well!





And a little minesweeper - this scheme is suitable for MS up to 500t.







Interesting note - all I had to do to create this one was click "Generate" - the scuttles and the little bit of superstructure are already built into the hull and funnel files, as are the captions on top! I figured nobody wanted to spend too much time twiddling with MSs, so it should be extra-easy to create them.



You can't generate destroyers out of the same set however. Well, you can, but they sure won't look like destroyers, more like...


Don't ask 

Part of the reason I added those labels on top was to alert the player which type of ship the parts are supposed to be for.


And finally, a 900t gunboat - these seem to also work fine up to 1200t, then the images sort of break. Still fixable

[marcorossolini]

How on earth did I miss this?!?

Those are flippin' awesome!

[Nuno dos Santos]

It seems I've stayed away too long. It will be hard to top ccip now!

Great looking drawings, ccip, I'm looking foward to using them,... for enemy ships, that is, I'll use the color sets for my own navy. 

And speaking of that, here's my Set13-military green, as promised.

Here are some examples, so people can see how they look like, I hope you like it:
Battleship:

www.mediafire.com/view/2ym82z307mla0xl/Tirol0.bmp

Cruiser:

www.mediafire.com/view/6ra9kbnil2layqy/Bravo%20(R%201916)0.bmp

Destroyer:

www.mediafire.com/view/ih4vmvxfnks4al0/Hakaze0.bmp

Also I've improved set12, US navy Measure 22 camo. Now the hull as the grey upper hull patter automaticaly applied to it, but only wen selecting raised forecastle.
here's an example:

www.mediafire.com/view/25seanrp8idtnid/Montana.bmp

I've added an extra acessory, the sloped deckline in grey, so you can use both, as in this example, should you go for raised forcastle and quarterdeck.

www.mediafire.com/view/fybqst4v7tntr45/Bon%20Homme%20Richard0.bmp

Here are the two sets, zipped.

www.mediafire.com/file/35cfosrzvedd5wg/ShipParts_Sets12-13.rar

Or you can download the all lot again (I'm also puting this on the first post, for convinience).

www.mediafire.com/file/df744w5zav4fkfa/ShipParts+sets+1+to+13.rar

Have fun. And keep up the good work.

[ccip]

Looking great as always

Any other sets you have in the pipeline? I ask mostly so I know what to number this batch!

Got a bit more chipped away today - and as it happens, also settled on the number of sets I'll have to be making now, which is 6: two each for legacy, early, and late ships. The legacy sets are getting close to done now, and today's work was mainly on these:



Quite useful for all your obsolete cruiser, aviso, and legacy scout needs!

The last batch of hulls left to do for this set now is the one for legacy CAs.

[Nuno dos Santos]

Nov 3, 2016 0:13:13 GMT -6 ccip said:

Any other sets you have in the pipeline? I ask mostly so I know what to number this batch!

Well, that's it for now.
This completes the sets I had in mind and that I had already mentioned.

I was trying to make thumblehomes but they came out looking like bulges. I may have to fiddle with the actual hull to get the shadding so as to give the appearence of the thumblehome. Even if I get it just for the B hulls, it would require an example for each set with a diferent colour. I would probably put it all in a proper folder, and then people would create the sets they would want to have thumblehomes by moving them to the desired folder. Still, I would still have to get it rigth.


Apart from that, I had thougth of some camouflage paint schemes, but most would be tricky. I may get into that. Any ideas? Hulls are doable but continuity between hull and  upper works are next to impossible. still...

[kungfutreachery]

How do you change the auto-generated turrets? Do you just paste the new ones over them?