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Post by galagagalaxian on Sept 8, 2016 19:42:41 GMT -6
How could you tell the torpedoes were malfunctioning? were you seeing probably hits on the icons but no reported explosion?
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Post by ddg on Sept 8, 2016 20:25:02 GMT -6
Hit! But no explosion. (Clunk! Dammit) I have now played this same game (as Germans) through three update versions after selecting varied tech but I'm afraid I'm at a loss to describe any obvious results of selecting the varied technology option. The only really unusual event was the warning I received about my scientists not believing that multi-gun turrets were a wise path to pursue. I am now at 1930 in the game and I've had improved triple turrets for probably 10 years so I suspect any bad things that would have arisen from my scientist's skepticism have now been overcome. I really didn't see any other anomalous behavior. I'll try again with varied tech and see what happens when I not going through so many updates and without the turret bug. Did you by any chance check to see if your triple turrets weighed the usual amount? Inefficiency could manifest as weight or cost as well as jams. Or perhaps a RoF penalty?
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Post by joebob73 on Sept 8, 2016 20:32:38 GMT -6
How could you tell the torpedoes were malfunctioning? were you seeing probably hits on the icons but no reported explosion? They were disappearing mid-run. And it wasn't a few, it was more than half of them.
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Post by jwsmith26 on Sept 8, 2016 22:18:01 GMT -6
Hit! But no explosion. (Clunk! Dammit) I have now played this same game (as Germans) through three update versions after selecting varied tech but I'm afraid I'm at a loss to describe any obvious results of selecting the varied technology option. The only really unusual event was the warning I received about my scientists not believing that multi-gun turrets were a wise path to pursue. I am now at 1930 in the game and I've had improved triple turrets for probably 10 years so I suspect any bad things that would have arisen from my scientist's skepticism have now been overcome. I really didn't see any other anomalous behavior. I'll try again with varied tech and see what happens when I not going through so many updates and without the turret bug. Did you by any chance check to see if your triple turrets weighed the usual amount? Inefficiency could manifest as weight or cost as well as jams. Or perhaps a RoF penalty? I'm not familiar enough with the ROF penalties to tell if anything unusual was happening. And I'm afraid I've now overwritten that slot so I can't check on the turret weight or cost. It would be pretty hard to tell if something was amiss with the weight without seeing the same turrets in another game with all of the same tech improvements that affect weight in place.
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Post by ddg on Sept 8, 2016 23:40:00 GMT -6
You're certainly right that it would be difficult to check. For RoF, I would first look to the in-combat ship information window, but it's entirely possible that a permanent penalty wouldn't appear there. I may keep the weights and costs in mind when I try varied tech myself.
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Post by marauder on Sept 9, 2016 10:03:53 GMT -6
Something I've noticed while playing with Varied Technology is that sometimes when I start a new game, the penetration on all guns will be quite a bit lower than usual. For example, the usual 6.4" penetration on the -1 quality 12" gun is now 5.2"(or something similiar to that, I don't remember the exact number). Developements in AP shell technology didn't really "fix" it, the values always were a few inches below the standard values you'd get in a game without Varied Tech. This sure made early battles drag on, with most of them ending inconclusive, save for the odd torpedo kill or fire raging out of control here and there.
Now what interests me is if anyone here has noticed the same, or maybe even an increase in penetration right at the game start?
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Post by galagagalaxian on Sept 9, 2016 14:52:19 GMT -6
Yeah, just started a few games as Britain on varied tech, it took a few restarts, but eventually I hit one where the numbers were different: (totally swapped the entry titles on accident, oh well, bask in my shame!) I wonder how well the AI would adapt to this change. Players would probably love it. Less armor, more guns/speed!
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tuna
New Member
Posts: 18
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Post by tuna on Sept 9, 2016 19:02:45 GMT -6
In the save game (RTWGameX in save folder number X) there is a new field TechQuirk. It seems to correspond to varied tech. Values I know: TechQuirk=3 seems to be bad twin and triple turrets, and
TechQuirk=4 is low penetration on guns
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Post by Bullethead on Sept 11, 2016 20:11:07 GMT -6
Hmmmm.... I'm playing with Varied Tech. I researched the ability to have 3 main battery turrets. However, I can't use this on a battleship because the game treats this a a BB instead of a B, and telss me I haven't yet researched how to build BBs.
Is that intentional?
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Post by jwsmith26 on Sept 11, 2016 21:57:12 GMT -6
You need to have researched 2 techs in Ship Design before you can build a BB. Usually 3 centerline turrets is about the 3rd of 4th Ship Design tech that I research but the tech system can take strange paths and skip over some techs so you might have gotten 3 centerline turrets as your first tech under Ship Design. If that has happened you may not be able to actually build a BB until you research another Ship Design tech. Or it may be varied tech at work.
Did you get any kind of warning from your scientists?
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Post by director on Sept 12, 2016 7:48:28 GMT -6
I don;t recall any pre-dreadnoughts with triple turrets. Weird American designs that wore a twin 8" atop the main turret like some surrealistic dictator's hat, yes, but not triple turrets. The first ship I know of with just two main-gun turrets that were triples is the panzerschiffe (pocket battleship) Deutschland of 1932.
So it's likely just a case that you can't do it because no-one ever did it.
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Post by marauder on Sept 12, 2016 8:58:14 GMT -6
Today I resumed one of my saved games with the low penetration modifier that I mentioned earlier in this thread and noticed something strange. When I checked pen on the 15" gun BC I was about to order, I saw that the penetration had jumped back up to standard values you'd find in a non-varied tech game. It wasn't just the 15" guns, but every gun in the game. The 12" guns jumped from 6.1" to 10.5" at 5000 yards, for example. So I reloaded my save and kept an eye on the gun data after every tech advance. Turns out that researching the Stable Explosive Filler technology nullifies the low penetration modifier.
I don't know if this is intended or not(probably not), so I'll post it here instead of the bug report thread for now.
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Post by Bullethead on Sept 12, 2016 10:38:45 GMT -6
You need to have researched 2 techs in Ship Design before you can build a BB. Usually 3 centerline turrets is about the 3rd of 4th Ship Design tech that I research but the tech system can take strange paths and skip over some techs so you might have gotten 3 centerline turrets as your first tech under Ship Design. If that has happened you may not be able to actually build a BB until you research another Ship Design tech. Or it may be varied tech at work. Did you get any kind of warning from your scientists? Well, here's my research status at present: With this combination of tech, in varied tech, I can't build battleships with 3 centerline turrets because even though I start them as Bs in the design screen, the game insists on calling them BBs, and then telling me I'm not capable of building BBs yet. It has no problem letting me build this ship:
But it won't let me build this ship (which wasn't a finished design, just partially along. I got the error message shown when I hit the Check button).
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Post by jwsmith26 on Sept 12, 2016 11:12:52 GMT -6
Well, if that isn't due to varied tech, then it looks like a bug to me. You should be able to build a BB with the tech level you have achieved.
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Post by Bullethead on Sept 12, 2016 12:06:50 GMT -6
Well, if that isn't due to varied tech, then it looks like a bug to me. You should be able to build a BB with the tech level you have achieved. Hmnm. OK. Meanwhile, I was tinkering with this some more. It turns out I can make a 3-turret CA without the game throwing a fit and saying it's really a BC, provided the guns are no bigger than 10". If I put 11" or bigger on it, then the game says it's a BC. But I can't make a 3-turret B at all, regardless of gun caliber. For instance, here's a 3-turret CA, which to all intents and purposes is a weak BC. The game has no problem with this.
---------------------------------------------- EDIT: Hmm, if I reduce the B's guns to 10", then it stays a B and the game is happy. It still won't let me build a BB, but I can make a 6x 10" B. With 11" or bigger guns, a 3-turret battleship is classified as a BB and the game won't let me build it.
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