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Post by oldpop2000 on Aug 20, 2018 13:49:02 GMT -6
I just want to point out some historical factors about action in the Mediterranean during WW2 which may or may not have any bearing on the game. The British faced a difficult choice in the Mediterranean after Italy declared war and more importantly, the French collapsed which eliminated the French Navy. The agreement with the French was that they would handle the Italian Navy in the Mediterranean from their North African bases and Toulon. Now the British were alone in trying to get supplies to the Suez. The distance around the Cape from the Clyde to the Suez was 12,860 miles. For a convoy to reach the Suez and return required well over 20,000 miles longer than the trip through the Mediterranean. This also required more naval escorts and faster cargo and liners to bring the troops and supplies to the Suez. The trip to India was even farther to support operations in that region and any supplies to Australia required about 1500 more miles. While they did have Malta, they had neglected its defenses. Economics and their reliance on the French changed the British attitude. The British Royal Air force abandoned Malta for Alexandria. This harbor was not very well developed and not very suitable for ship repair and unloading of supplies. This story gets much more complex, but these are the essential reasons for what happened in the Med. Will this happen in the game? Only if the same sequence of actions take place. So, in using history as a guide, be aware of the variables that caused the British problems in the Med. These variables might not occur in the game. Source: In Passage Perilous: Malta and the Convoy Battles of June 1942 by Vince O’Hara You are right. British and Germans quickly realize importance of Malta supporting convoys and attack Italians convoys (Italians had quite a lot of lost due to FAA operations from Malta). They know that if Malta falls, North Africa can fall opening way to oil fields which could have global effects. However invading Malta was something completely out of possibility for Italy and Germany till complete naval superiority in the Mediterranean. British knows it well and put a lot of efforts to supply Malta. Resulting carriers battles were completely different from carriers battles in Pacific however fierce and scale of air attacks were something that Allies did not face earlier and even after till attacks on Japanese islands. However this is quite difficult to simulate if you not put whole strategy of war so I expect that in case of RTW there can be more convoys battles in the Med. There might be but never forget.... you facing a computer program, not a human and that does make a difference. Another issue is the improvement in submarine technologies. If you review your history of carriers, the British lost three carriers to submarines. We lost one, USS Wasp. The Japanese lost four. I am referring to fleet carriers, not escort or light carriers. That is a total of eight fleet carriers sunk by submarines, so it is important.
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Post by Noname117 on Aug 23, 2018 13:50:41 GMT -6
You are right. British and Germans quickly realize importance of Malta supporting convoys and attack Italians convoys (Italians had quite a lot of lost due to FAA operations from Malta). They know that if Malta falls, North Africa can fall opening way to oil fields which could have global effects. However invading Malta was something completely out of possibility for Italy and Germany till complete naval superiority in the Mediterranean. British knows it well and put a lot of efforts to supply Malta. Resulting carriers battles were completely different from carriers battles in Pacific however fierce and scale of air attacks were something that Allies did not face earlier and even after till attacks on Japanese islands. However this is quite difficult to simulate if you not put whole strategy of war so I expect that in case of RTW there can be more convoys battles in the Med. There might be but never forget.... you facing a computer program, not a human and that does make a difference. Another issue is the improvement in submarine technologies. If you review your history of carriers, the British lost three carriers to submarines. We lost one, USS Wasp. The Japanese lost four. I am referring to fleet carriers, not escort or light carriers. That is a total of eight fleet carriers sunk by submarines, so it is important. We lost 2 to submarines. The finishing blow on Yorktown was a torpedo salvo launched by a submarine; the ship would've most likely survived had the submarine not been there.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Aug 23, 2018 14:39:04 GMT -6
There might be but never forget.... you facing a computer program, not a human and that does make a difference. Another issue is the improvement in submarine technologies. If you review your history of carriers, the British lost three carriers to submarines. We lost one, USS Wasp. The Japanese lost four. I am referring to fleet carriers, not escort or light carriers. That is a total of eight fleet carriers sunk by submarines, so it is important. We lost 2 to submarines. The finishing blow on Yorktown was a torpedo salvo launched by a submarine; the ship would've most likely survived had the submarine not been there. She was sunk by I-68. I don't count it because if she had not been so heavily damage before, she would have been able to avoid the torpedoes. However, in reality, those torpedoes sank her. Thanks
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Post by Noname117 on Aug 23, 2018 14:47:07 GMT -6
Maybe it should count as half a kill, since without the air attack, the sub would not have sunk her, but without the sub, the ship wouldn't have sunk.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Aug 23, 2018 15:00:44 GMT -6
Maybe it should count as half a kill, since without the air attack, the sub would not have sunk her, but without the sub, the ship wouldn't have sunk. I did some research to verify what I believe happened. Apparently the day after the attacks on Yorktown, she was undertow at 3 knots by the minesweeper Vireo. However, she just could not perform the mission and it was abandoned. The Yorktown was screened by five destroyers during an attempt to salvage her. At 1:35 pm she was attacked by two torpedoes. She began to list, and at 5:01 am the next day she sank. So, she was, in fact, a sitting duck. While the torpedoes did the final work, it could have easily been one of the destroyers protecting her eventually performing that mission. I count this as a destruction by air attack with final blow from a submarine.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Sept 2, 2018 15:48:11 GMT -6
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