yyz
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Post by yyz on Jul 27, 2014 3:10:03 GMT -6
Hi! I am considering buying RJW SAI but would like to try to create campaigns with american battleships (Indiana class, Iowa , Kearsarge class, Illinois class, Maine class , Virginia class, Connecticut class) I use Kilkis as Mississippi class
If it's not against rules and fair use please somebody share these designs (files from Designs folder in SAI folder)
Best regards
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Post by randomizer on Jul 27, 2014 7:17:00 GMT -6
All the American pre-dreadnoughts back to the 1895 Maine and Texas are included in SAI-RJW and you can use DesignShip 2 that comes with SAI-TGWAS to create your own versions of them as desired. Be advised however, that just swapping ship designs between the games may result in unexpected or unsatisfactory combat results as FW made some fundamental design changes to how gunnery and damage is treated in SAI-RJW to better represent that era.
Thanks.
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yyz
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Post by yyz on Jul 27, 2014 12:36:46 GMT -6
Thanks Will try SAI-RJW
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 4:30:48 GMT -6
Just thought I would mention there is plenty of pre-dreadnought action to be had with SAI-TGW. I am not sure if the combat is working properly. I wouldn't know, becuase with pre-dreadnoughts I usually try to close to a few thousand yards, where the combat results are always unexpected. BTW, I couldn't resist the ship pictures in the R&H mod.
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Post by Fredrik W on Jul 28, 2014 9:20:28 GMT -6
There was considerable development between the RJW and WW1, in gunfire accuracy, rate of fire and shell quality and penetration. The combat algorithms are modified in SAI RJW to reflect this. Predreadnoughts in SAI TGW are assumed to have gotten the relevant upgrades, so will perform better than their own selves 10 years earlier in SAI RJW. It really depends on what time period you want to simulate.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Jul 28, 2014 14:25:29 GMT -6
There was considerable development between the RJW and WW1, in gunfire accuracy, rate of fire and shell quality and penetration. The combat algorithms are modified in SAI RJW to reflect this. Predreadnoughts in SAI TGW are assumed to have gotten the relevant upgrades, so will perform better than their own selves 10 years earlier in SAI RJW. It really depends on what time period you want to simulate. FredriK
Is it possible to develop a series of calibration factors for situations where you want to use ship designs from one game to another. Could DesignShip 2 be modified to allow for a field which designates which war and then adds or subtracts the calibration figures. This would simulate upgrades and updates as the ship ages.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2014 0:30:26 GMT -6
There was considerable development between the RJW and WW1, in gunfire accuracy, rate of fire and shell quality and penetration. The combat algorithms are modified in SAI RJW to reflect this. Predreadnoughts in SAI TGW are assumed to have gotten the relevant upgrades, so will perform better than their own selves 10 years earlier in SAI RJW. It really depends on what time period you want to simulate. Cool! So do Dreadnoughts in SAI TGW get relevant upgrades too?
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Post by Fredrik W on Jul 29, 2014 4:48:42 GMT -6
Well, TGWAS was actually developed first, and the combat mechanics were developed for WW1 naval combat. To be correct, the performance of ships was actually downgraded for SAI RJW to get it right for the RJW period.
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yyz
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Post by yyz on Aug 5, 2014 9:57:18 GMT -6
All the American pre-dreadnoughts back to the 1895 Maine and Texas are included in SAI-RJW and you can use DesignShip 2 that comes with SAI-TGWAS to create your own versions of them as desired. Be advised however, that just swapping ship designs between the games may result in unexpected or unsatisfactory combat results as FW made some fundamental design changes to how gunnery and damage is treated in SAI-RJW to better represent that era. Thanks. And what about designs and campaigns of WWI ? Will they be correct in RJW?
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Post by randomizer on Aug 5, 2014 10:29:14 GMT -6
Probably not totally but they will still work. In some cases WW1 the models should have different gun quality bonuses or penalties. There is far more HE in the RJW period particularly for calibres < 8" and poorer performance from AP to represent assorted terminal effects variables.
You may see odd or unintentional effects when swapping designs between eras.
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yyz
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Post by yyz on Aug 5, 2014 10:58:41 GMT -6
Probably not totally but they will still work. In some cases WW1 the models should have different gun quality bonuses or penalties. There is far more HE in the RJW period particularly for calibres < 8" and poorer performance from AP to represent assorted terminal effects variables. You may see odd or unintentional effects when swapping designs between eras. Hm, when I've seen 'year' settings in editor I thought it will adjust historical data automatically. As for HE/APC preferred use for countries - for Japan tactically only HE was chosen and for Russia, France APC is obligatory. Not sure for Britain - (liddite) HE/semiAP (with awful black powder) should be chosen by AI depending on distance and expected effect on armor.
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Post by fredsanford on Aug 5, 2014 12:38:38 GMT -6
Let me see if I understand, from a slightly different POV. I THINK the sdf file reference in a scenario or campaign is a relative, not an absolute, reference. Say I make a campaign, and it has a King Edward VII-class B called the "Africa" in it. I save the campaign into the 'campaign' subdirectory in RJW. I open it in RJW. I assume the campaign will look at the sdf file in the RJW/Designs(or custom) directory. If that same campaign is copied into the SAI Campaign folder, and opened in SAI (WW1 version), then it will look for the King Edward VII class entry there, and it will play under those standards. Right?
I think part of it may be that a cannon that has a "0" quality modifier in 1905 might be a "-1" by 1914, or a "-2" by 1920. So the 'basic' sdf file for a ship armed with these weapons would need to be edited to correspond. I'm also not sure how armor quality is considered (i.e. Harvey/Krupp/etc.).
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Post by randomizer on Aug 5, 2014 13:12:15 GMT -6
As I recall there are some hard coded changes to armour penetration algorithms to model the inferior quality of turn of the century AP and what might be considered SAP in addition to earlier period doctrinal norms. But I could have it wrong. However, ships in the RJW will attempt to close to shorter battle ranges and CA's will be less reluctant to flee from B's. In the RJW a generic torpedo is preferred with shorter range and less hitting power for a given diameter than the varieties available in SAI-TGWAS.
FW will need to weigh in on the specifics but essentially if you choose to swap designs between the executables you may experience unintended consequences or counter-intuitive events. The executables were never designed to be mixed as far as I know.
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