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Post by cwemyss on Sept 15, 2015 22:22:53 GMT -6
I didn't see a v1.21 bugs thread, forgive me if I missed it. I had a ship design that was completely legal in v1.1, now illegal in v1.21... with one in service and four more under construction. It's giving me an error stating "building nation hasn't researched double or triple turrets for CL". Picture is below. My legacy fleet (1899) had twin fore and aft 6" turret CLs. The current-design smaller cousin to the Birmingham, the Omaha class, has twin 6" turrets fore and aft, and isn't giving the same error in the Design screen. So is this working as designed, and what changed? Also (related?) I've got "Superimposed Turrets for DD" researched, but I can't design a new CL with a superimposed B-turret. That just doesn't seem quite right.  |
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Post by tmp on Sept 16, 2015 10:36:07 GMT -6
Yeah, that's fairly recent change by the looks of it, I think done while restricting these excessive turret configurations in 1.2 that were possible before. It does make sense to restrict double/triple turrets from use if there's specific tech for that and you don't have it researched, so in that sense that's likely previous bug that was fixed. For the superimposed turrets on CLs, it's also a specific tech that's separate from one that unlocks superimposed turrets on DDs.
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Post by Fredrik W on Sept 16, 2015 11:30:27 GMT -6
Yes, this was changed exactly as tmp described, so it's intentional.
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Post by cwemyss on Sept 16, 2015 12:04:36 GMT -6
Bummer... my v1.1 CLs are likely going to be my best CLs for quite a while, then. :-) I haven't had the Birminghams or my other CL's with twin turrets get into combat since I upgraded... even though the design is now illegal, will they still operate as intended or do I need to just start the game over?
RE the CL vs. DD superimposed turrets... I understand it's a separate tech, it just feels weird that I can do it on a 'can, but not on a cruiser.
Is there a 'tech tree' documented somewhere?
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Post by cwemyss on Sept 16, 2015 12:14:04 GMT -6
And a quick "I'll be darned" from a wiki search I probably shouldn't be doing at work:
HMS Enterprise (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Enterprise_(D52)) appears to be the first RN light cruiser with a twin turret, launched 1919, commissioned 1926
USS Omaha (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Omaha_(CL-4)), launched 1920, commissioned 1923, was the first for the USN.
Most of the German had CLs through WW1 were armed with single 150-mm guns
I keep trying to design equivalents to the Iowa BB, Baltimore CA, and Cleveland CL. I have much learning to do about pre-WW2 ships. :-)
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Post by Fredrik W on Sept 16, 2015 12:19:43 GMT -6
It will not affect existing designs, it just limits new ship designs, so saved games should be compatible.
It might seem illogical, but I had to block the ability to build modern CL and DD ahead of their time. Normally you should get the CL superimposed turrets first.
There is no tech tree as such, as I intentionally avoided a deterministic approach to research. I wanted some techs to be late or maybe even not appearing at all to increase variability. (Background: The thing I disliked most in MOO2 was that when you had invented the Neutron Blaster, you could whip anyone because that was the best overall weapon considering its bang per weight. So you just had to wait until you invented the NB and then you could conquer the Galaxy!) There is however a file called "ResearchAreas.dat", which governs research. You can study that to see the usual progression of research.
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Post by cwemyss on Sept 16, 2015 12:25:59 GMT -6
Awesome, I'll take a look.
For what it's worth, I like what you've done with... well... everything. Nerfing modern CL/DD before their time is a great example, it keeps things realistic. And the variability is what makes a game replayable.
Keep up the great work!
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