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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 13, 2016 20:54:54 GMT -6
The purpose of this thread is, if I am honest, mostly selfish. I bet I have played something like 1.2 games a week of RTW since I was steered to it, and it simply feels a crying shame to me to invest so much in developing a Navy only to see it resigned to memory and get overwritten in a month or so. I have craved a game like this since I had Jutland laid out across my living-room floor for 2 days, much to my parent's consternation. Now 30 years later, I have this embodiment of all my Admiralty dreams, for which I am amazingly thankful.
So, here for my benefit I will distill what might be of merit from each game's history, and hopefully perhaps provide a moment of interest or entertainment along the way. Additionally, it will probably be good for me just as an intellectual exercise to avoid immediately launching into another game. I always play to 1950 (unless I resign after a tragic failure) simply because I don't want to say goodbye to "my" navy, which has been built from bolt and plate and blood to be the perfect instrument of her masters.
Well, with no further ado, let me dig into the memory banks and document a few games. I have developed a general preference for 40% tech advancement & varied, for it allows the "adolescent stage" to be prolonged a bit. True, I will likely not have "The Old R's" at sea in 1914, but a middle teens war will still be fairly reflective of DN action, and the 1940's will still feature the top-end super-battleships. If I alter these ratios for a game, I will mention it in the pre-amble.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 13, 2016 22:12:33 GMT -6
Game 1, Japan. End 1950, Prestige 71. Budget = 737,694,580 This game was a good success, yielding my favorite pair of far ports, Rhodes and Madagascar. Both being islands are less inconceivable for Japan to administer, and I love having as many sea zones as I can with friendly harbors. Rhodes Madagascar Sumatra Formosa Kwang-Chou-Wan Northern Marianas Caroline Islands Bismarck Archipelago Japan Kiautschou Bay Northern Korea Southern Korea Sakhalin Polynesia Capital ships were lost in 7 separate actions, ...including on my birthday in 1924. Ah well, regrettable. 1903 v Germany; B Shikishima, Yashima-Class, 16000 tons, launched 1903, to battle. 1924 v Germany; BC Kurama, Ikoma-Class, 19800 tons, launched 1910 (R1923), to battle. 1926 v Germany; BC Ikoma, Ikoma-Class, 19800 tons, launched 1910 (R1923), to battle. 1932 v Germany; BB Hizen, Fuji-Class, 16000 tons, launched 1915 (R1928), to battle. 1938 v Germany; BB Shinano, Mikasa-Class, 40000 tons, launched 1925 (R1929), to submarine. 1938 v Russia; BB Kashima, Fuji-Class, 16000 tons, launched 1917 (R1928), to submarine. 1945 v France; BB Fuji, Fuji-Class, 16000 tons, launched 1912 (R1928), to submarine. Japan's first domestic dreadnoughts served for nearly 40 years, 5 of the class seeing retirement in 1950. The game pressed hard against Germany and Russia, with only a single war I can recall against France. Germany has many possessions which they seem loathe to defend with vigor, so they are a natural foe. This game was played far enough ago such that I can recall few details, though the long-serving Fuji's were a personal favorite- that required enormous coddling as time moved on. The Ikoma class were a novel experiment, being semi-DN battlecruisers; imgur.com/a/JDcf9Well, rookie glitch, I can't figure out how to make images appear in the post. I'll do that in the future, but here are the profiles of my capital ship classes, as well as the endgame fleet totals page. The White ships were laid down in the USA, I leave ships in their "delivery" color (vaguely by national preference) just for some differentiation. I will try to remember more "history" for successive posts.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 17, 2016 9:41:46 GMT -6
Game 2, Germany.
For this game, I will not yet record any details. I decided to attempt to make this my Byzantium, and so kept a meticulous record from which to fashion a full AAR history. I found that the most expedient way to record data was simply to take screen shots, so I have about 2080 of them documenting every ship, action, and random event that occurred. The archive is a real trove, but it will be some time before the Grossadmiral's memoirs can be composed (i.e., life too demanding to undertake such a project at present).
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 17, 2016 10:10:26 GMT -6
Game 3, Byzantium. End 1928, Prestige 35. Budget = 223,512,100
This game, my Actual Byzantium, was a Gross disaster from which the Navarch resigned in disgrace after war with Spain ended with the loss of the Suez Canal. Unwisely deciding to undertake expensive refits of the first class of pre-dreadnoughts, by the time new ships could be laid down it was too late. Byzanitum only managed to launch 2 modern capital ships, and both of these battle cruisers were lost to Italian battleships. When war with Spain could not be avoided, it was ignominious flight from nearly every action, resulting in the loss of numerous cruisers.
Asia Minor Cyprus
Both Byzantine capital ships were lost SW of Cyprus on St. Patrick's Day.
1926 v Italy, BC Pyr Thalassion, Pyr Thalassion Class, 30000 tons, launched 1912 (R1924), to battle. 1926 v Italy, BC Navarch, Pyr Thalassion Class, 30000 tons, launched 1914 (R1924), to battle.
Not only were 8 pre-dreadnoughts re-fit, but 4 Armored Cruisers expensively up-engined to 27 knots, which price Byzantium could not bear. They clogged the ways for most of a decade until they could be completed, a memorium to the lesson that sometimes it is better to let Old just be Old.
I don't count any of my designs for this game to be artistic in any way, so I will not preserve their memory. Let the stain sink in the sea!
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Post by director on Dec 17, 2016 19:24:02 GMT -6
Not sure if it's OK to post here - if not, just let me know and I'll remove it.
That's a better outcome as Japan than I've ever had, though you lost more capital ships than I usually do. It "Paris is worth a Mass" then perhaps a province is worth a battleship.
I send you my deepest and most sincere sympathies for your Byzantium game... I've had good and bad games as Byzantium, and as you say it is usually a lack of money that does them in. I had a similar situation with the US, where I put everything in the yards for upgrades and immediately got thrown into a war with (I think) Germany. Took six months or so to get out from under the blockade and years to get the victory point totals right and get my lost provinces back. In the process I sank a lot of German steel... I was - really - upset.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 18, 2016 21:23:17 GMT -6
I can imagine. I felt resignation was my only recourse in my case, having only floating targets for a navy. Commenting here is fine, I think it is a dubious enterprise for me to create this archive, but fundamentally I hope it is interesting to others else it would just be in a folder on my desktop, so comment away!
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 23, 2016 21:05:20 GMT -6
Game 4, England. End 1950, Prestige 46. Budget = 829,948,290. This game was not as successful in Prestige points, though it produced my most decisive victory ever. I suppose if you play a millennium's worth of campaigns you'll eventually have your Trafalgar. England lost Ireland to revolution, but added to its empire in the main; United Kingdom Malta Egypt Gibraltar Cyprus Rhodes Sardinia Cameroon Sierra Leone Angola Southwest Africa Nigeria ...um, everything in the Indian Ocean except Madagascar & Djibouti, Malaya Singapore Northern Marianas Caroline Islands Bismarck Archipelago Australia Hong Kong Weihaiwei Kiautschou Bay Liautung Peninsula Sakhalin All the South Pacific, & the New World essentially "as is". Modern Capital ships were lost in 4 separate actions- ALL taking place after May of 1946, and all in the Great War with Rome. 1946 v Italy; BB Majestic, Magnificent Class, 19000 tons, launched 1906 (R1926), to Mine. 1946 v Italy; BC Inflexible, Invincible Class, 24000 tons, launched 1922 (R1929), to submarine. 1946 v Italy; BB Irresistible, Irresistible Class, 28000 tons, launched 1914 (R1937), to battle. 1946 v Italy; BC Invincible, Invincible Class, 24000 tons, launched 1911 (R1929), to battle. 1947 v Italy; BB Magnificent, Magnificent Class, 19000 tons, launched 1906 (R1926), to battle. 1947 v Italy; BB Victorious, Magnificent Class, 19000 tons, launched 1906 (R1926), to battle. 1947 v Italy; BB Jupiter, Magnificent Class, 19000 tons, launched 1906 (R1926), to battle. 4 Pre-dreadnoughts were lost as well. The first to a torpedo from a Fleet Action against Germany in 1902, 2 others in the Second Tsarist War of 1927, and the 4th was mined during the 1920-21 war against the Franco-Russo Coalition, where-in England scored her most astounding victory since Nelson. 1902 v Germany; B Renown, Camperdown Class, 16000 tons, launched 1898, to battle. 1921 v France; B Ramilies, Camperdown Class, 16000 tons, launched 1898 (R1917), to Mine. 1927 v Russia; B Benbow, Camperdown Class, 16000 tons, launched 1899 (R1917), to submarine. 1927 v Russia; B Repulse, Camperdown Class, 16000 tons, launched 1899 (R1917), to submarine. The Franco-Russo War of 1920 climaxed with an action off Brest in early 1921, where the Home Fleet met the Marine National in a decisive decision. 9 British DNs and 2 BCs, with 10 Bs and 21 auxiliaries met 9 French DNs and 3 BCs, quite strangely sailing with no escort. 9 of the 12 French ships were sunk, to no Royal Navy losses. Fortune and planning favored the English, who read the wind gauge and sailed steadily into the 12000 yard murk, and the English line chanced to catch the French line as they were wheeling onto the English heading. Each ship sailed out of the haze to be greeted by the united broadsides of 4-8 ships, and the Home Fleet eventually was able to calmly turn back through the graveyard, allowing even the old Pre-Dreadnoughts to feel they were pulling their weight as they blazed away at the burning hulks. 636,435 vp to 45,508. Only one English ship suffered heavy damage. Many of those same victorious ships faced their ends in the crowded waters off Taranto 20 years later, where imprudent night-time pursuits caused the Mediterranean flag admiral to be cashiered following the second such occurrence, perhaps revealing something akin to a Victory Disease had set in. The low prestige score was mostly due to steadfastly working to avoid conflicts that could not yield territory, and as well a great effort to avoid going to war with other democracies following the war with France. Some of the profiles I originated I am fond of, so I will save them to perhaps eventually add here. ...so I will foolishly forget to save them.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 26, 2016 19:14:22 GMT -6
Game 5, Spain. End 1950, Prestige 32. Budget = 320,035,450. This game was a Meat-grinder. Spent prestige avoiding wars that would crush me, fought 3 wars with Italy- gained Sardinia, lost Sardinia when France helped them, then gained back Sardinia- but in the end Spanish holdings grew; and my Sunk fleet was larger than my finishing fleet. It seems like I couldn't sink anything without a tit-for-tat loss happening. However, the Armada's dream was brought to fruition, thanks to 1 of 3 timely colonial grabs; Ireland (let's just look at that one for a while...) Venezuela Sumatra All other 1900's Spanish holdings retained. 1936 v France; BC Vizcaya, Vizcaya Class, 24000 tons, launched 1922, to battle. 1937 v France; BB Numancia I, Numancia I Class, 27000 tons, launched 1910 (R1930), to battle. 1937 v France; BB San Telmo, Reina Dona Isabel II Class, 17000 tons, launched 1920, to battle. 1937 v France; BB Argonauta, Argonauta Class, 15000 tons, launched 1913, to battle. 1938 v France; BB Reina Dona Isabel II, Reina Dona Isabel II Class, 17000 tons, launched 1920, to battle. 1939 v France; BB Tridente, Argonauta Class, 15000 tons, launched 1913, to battle. 1946 v Italy; BB Tridente II, Real Familia Class, 37000 tons, launched 1944, to battle. 7 16000 ton cruisers were also lost, along with 5 7900 ton light cruisers, and FIFTY ONE (51) destroyers. There were about 15 total years under treaty restrictions, and the 10-inch gunned treaty cruiser became the main arbiter of decision. This game pointed out that Spain can definitely be a challenge, but I'm not sure I'd call it "fun" to me, per se. Spain's industrial base is a huge handicap, and a lot of effort needs to be spent avoiding conflicts that would be devastating. Still, a game survived without a net loss is good success.
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Post by director on Dec 26, 2016 20:22:01 GMT -6
Well, my first thought was, "What did the Irish ever do to deserve Spain?" And my second was, "What did Spain ever do to deserve Ireland?"
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Dec 26, 2016 21:35:39 GMT -6
Well, its all about the Guinness.
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Post by axe99 on Dec 27, 2016 16:45:20 GMT -6
That's pretty impressive, well Spained .
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Jan 1, 2017 16:28:14 GMT -6
Thank you! This next one though, I'm not quite sure how to explain it!
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Jan 1, 2017 18:15:09 GMT -6
Game 6, Japan. End 1950, Prestige 96. Budget = 751,248,820. This game I almost resigned from 3 times in disgust, and it became my most successful ever- by 20 points. The first time was when I realized my pre-dreadnought idea to limit secondary armament to allow for better shooting from the mains was a disaster. Without a strong secondary a pre-dreadnought is vershmiggen. The second time was when in my first close fought war with Russia, where with poorly designed capital ships every mistake could be ruin, signaling errors Twice cost me needless battleship losses. The 3rd time was when in a close fought war with England my formation at night blew up like a fox was tossed into the chicken coop, and I lost a BC & BB that I could not afford to as I watched my scattered formation pick their way home in the dark. ...however. Perseverance, care, and a treaty cruiser class that saved the day won out in the end, and in a throw back to the days of an older patch I collapsed the governments of Germany, England, and the US- 2 of them in the same war. This was my treaty cruiser, and thanks to a poorly/well-timed directive from the Emperor, ultimately there were 15 built. I was worried about the belt-armor, but in the end wanted to sure I had the firepower advantage. 4 were lost in action, from either timid use or poor fortune. If the ship was handled aggressively to put shells on target, it never lost. This is the prize ship I took from my successful war with the US, which I am including in the write-up only because I like the way it turned out. I wanted it to look foreign, so I departed from my general superstructure designs. The ship did not see action for Japan, but its presence in the home isles did help force a combat to be avoided by a foe. This ship provided for an amusing moment. Taken as a prize from our war with England, upon receipt we discovered it had a few elements that needed attention and improvement. So mere months after delivery to Kure, its English yard was approached and engaged to execute a few minor improvements. And, oh, while you're at it, could you build a second one so they can operate in tandem? One can only imagine this was hotly debated in the House of Lords. Oh, and when the newly delivered Nagato was torpedoed by a Russian sub? We had the cheek to order a replacement. Here lay the fallen, with a further 75 destroyers and MSs unseen. I have to say the treaty cruiser won this game for me, and following through on building 10 more when asked rather than a cheaper design just to satisfy the request. Undeniably my most successful game, and it only happened due to perseverance.
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Post by director on Jan 2, 2017 21:34:02 GMT -6
I know you will appreciate my saying that cruisers are the least appreciated and most important ships in the game. Not the only thing you need... but the one thing you absolutely must do best.
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Post by Airy W on Jan 3, 2017 7:57:10 GMT -6
Are cruisers underappreciated? I see them as the fighter jocks of the seas, the glory hounds that get all the girls. There's some line in Star Trek along the lines of... No one dreams about being a Star Fleet Admiral. They dream of being the captain of a ship like this one. [said in reference to a constitution class cruiser]
I think this is a problem with my thinking with reference to garrisons last update. I have fallen into a similar trap of skimping on the secondaries with my pre-dreads. If you limit yourself to 4 main guns (or even 3) and 4 secondaries, you can make a dreadnought that's a knot faster then early cruisers. Finally the battleships get to be rack up victories and be all sexy! The problem is that these ships are expensive as hell but age horribly. You need to make them as big as possible to fit that engine and armor but technological improvements and bigger dockyards will mean that in a few years their armor wont protect them and their engines wont let them escape because they hit the max speed of the hull form. Basically I'm creating myself new cruisers but more expensive and without the ability to increase the speed.
I'm only there were some middleground between the Teacup and the Maximum.
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