Data of US Naval Shipbuilders for RTW and RTW2 Time Frames

[bcoopactual]

I started what turned out to be a significant project wanting to add some background flavor for my ship designs in the form of being able to designate their actual builders.  So beginning in the Wikipedia pages for the various ship classes I started collecting info on who built what and when for the US Navy. 

I then got a little crazy and decided to update the information through the 1940s so it would be ready for RTW2.  By the time I had realized I had bit off more than I could chew I was into the destroyer escorts and minesweepers and I was thinking what the heck did I get myself into, LOL.  Anyway, some limitations on quickly finding what I was looking for using Wikipedia eventually led me to discover the excellent destroyerhistory.org for more information on the US destroyers and eventual destroyer escorts of WW2.  Having to determine whether Bethlehem Steel as the builder meant the Fore River or San Francisco or any number of other Bethlehem Steel shipyards then got me to the Mímisbrunnr of this project, www.shipbuildinghistory.com/  Fortunately, no sacrifices were required to drink from that pool of knowledge.

This is a sample of the end result:



I tried using some color to help separate out the different ship classifications.  If you don't like the colors, it's easy enough to just select all of the cells and go back to black ink. 

Like I stated earlier I made this for myself originally but I figured since it was there I would share it in case anyone else is interested.

If anybody ever decides to do a similar breakdown, doesn't have to be the exact same format, for the other nations in the game please feel free to post it to this thread.  I would definitely be interested to see it.  

Edit - I probably didn't do a well enough job explaining the fractions in the build numbers.  The numbers built are units actually delivered to the US (and in some cases for the DEs and CVEs, the Royal Navy).  Units that were delivered to one navy and then transferred to another are only counted once.  If the keel was actually laid down but the ship not completed then I added it to the numbers to the right of the slash.  If the keel was never actually laid down (Like the Montana-class battleships) then they are not counted.  So for example while the Montanas are not included in the BB numbers, BB-47 Washington, the six 1920 South Dakotas and the fifth and sixth Iowas are added to the shipyards' numbers.  For some of the smaller ships like minesweepers and DEs the records aren't as detailed.  In general if I couldn't tell, I included a cancelled unit if it had been named and did not include it if it was not.  So the numbers may be off slightly but it's close enough for my purposes and I'm not going to lose my mind over trying to get it perfect.       

I should also point out I used the delivery date to be consistent.  It does skew the 20s numbers though because the overwhelming majority of those ships were delivered in 1920-1922 because they were ordered for WW1.  The rest of the 20s were pretty thin for new construction since there was so many leftover ships from the WW1 building programs.  Plus the Naval limitation treaty of course.   

2nd Edit - I reloaded the document file after fixing some minor formatting issues and making sure to add credit for the websites I used at the bottom of the doc.

  

  

Attachments:

US Naval Shipbuilding Companies and Navy Ya....doc (192.5 KB)

[oldpop2000]

I don't know if these will contribute - ww2db.com/facility/shipyards_list


www.usmm.org/shipbuild.html


www.shipbuildinghistory.com/


- Anglo-American Shipbuilding in World War ....pdf (1.85 MB)

[bubby]

That's like, super neat. Thanks guys.

[garrisonchisholm]

This is a tremendous asset to anyone looking to do an AAR. Bravo Zulu BCoop. :]

[oldpop2000]

Just an interesting comparison of Japanese Shipyards to the US.

Based on information in the first link my post above, the Japanese had the following shipyards.
Kure Naval Arsenal
Mitsubishi Heavy Industries
Maizuru Naval Arsenal
Yokosuka Naval Arsenal
Sasebo Naval Arsenal

For the US
Bethlehem San Pedro Shipyard
Boston Navy Yard
Electric Boat Co.
Mare Island Navy Yard
New York Navy Yard
Norfolk Navy Yard
Pearl Harbor Navy Base
Philadelphia Navy Yard
Washington Navy Yard

The Japanese had five major shipyards to build and repair naval ships along with building merchant transports.

The US had eight major shipyards. This made a big difference during the war when it came to building and repairing ships. Pearl Harbor Navy Base was finally completed in early 1942 with additional slips and drydocks, This means our ships did no have to go far to get repaired. The nearest base outside of Japan was Singapore, and I am not certain how extensive that yard was. But the comparison is interesting, and I should do more research on this. It is a vital clue about how thing progressed in the Pacific. Even the base at Truk was not that big and without repair ships, most Japanese ships had to make the long, dangerous voyage back to Japan. 

This is not detailed and I need to do more in-depth research, but it is an indication of a problem never solved by the Japanese. Keep in mind that in the US we had a plethora of small shipyards on both coasts and along the Gulf of Mexico that could do repairs and build smaller ships and boats. 

[oldpop2000]

If I have some time over the next few days, I am going to research details of the major navies shipbuilding. Specifically the number slips, size of the ships that they can build and the manufacturing area around the yards. I have a detailed book on the British, the US is easy to find, and but the Japanese might more of a problem. The Germans, Italians and French should be available.

[bcoopactual]

Thanks bubby and garrisonchisholm .

oldpop2000 , because I haven't punished myself enough, I actually started looking into British shipbuilding records. I haven't been able to find an online UK equivalent to shipbuildinghistory.org. The scanned copy of Conways 1922-1946 that someone (I apologize I've forgotten who actually scanned that and I'm sorry because that was certainly a lot of work to get done) shared lists the builders for all of the ships of the major navies built from 1922 to 1946 so that would cover most of the post-RTW time frame for RTW2 but I don't have access to an earlier version that would cover the 1890-1922 time frame that I would need to build a comprehensive list like the one above for the USA.

[oldpop2000]

Aug 10, 2018 17:36:15 GMT -6 bcoopactual said:

Thanks bubby and garrisonchisholm .

oldpop2000 , because I haven't punished myself enough, I actually started looking into British shipbuilding records. I haven't been able to find an online UK equivalent to shipbuildinghistory.org. The scanned copy of Conways 1922-1946 that someone (I apologize I've forgotten who actually scanned that and I'm sorry because that was certainly a lot of work to get done) shared lists the builders for all of the ships of the major navies built from 1922 to 1946 so that would cover most of the post-RTW time frame for RTW2 but I don't have access to an earlier version that would cover the 1890-1922 time frame that I would need to build a comprehensive list like the one above for the USA.

It isn't available in ebook but is available in hardbound, you might check your library. Google books and Amazon both have it in hard edition. 

[oldpop2000]

 I wanted to start my brief on shipbuilding in the major wartime nations with the Japanese however, before I start, I want to bring to everyone’s attention the requirements for naval bases, shipyards and airbases. This will not be extensive, and we can continue to discuss this although I can’t be certain how RTW2 will handle it, it’s a lot of detail.

Naval bases and shipyards need infrastructure to operate. They need railroads and roads to move supplies to and from the base. It is better to have the manufacturing centers that produce the steel nearby along with foundry’s, and machine shops. They operate better with training schools in the area to prepare new hires and put them to work. Shipyards need flat area to install drydocks and fitting out docks for the final work on the ship. They need housing and markets along with other consumer orientated operations for the families. They need hospitals also and public schools.

But, and this is probably needless to state, they need a deep-water port with a wide inlet. Any ship bigger than a torpedo boat, needs depth of water. A ship with a draught of 40 feet will drop its stern low enough during sailing to bottom out on a 45-foot harbor floor. This will happen at around 15 knots. However, not all naval bases and shipyards can and will have these characteristics, so it will be of limited use. Another factor is weather. Some ports ice over in the winter, specifically Vladivostok. If you study the RJW, you will see this problem affecting the naval war. As you might guess, harbors must dredged and inlets can be widened. This is what happened to Pearl Harbor. Unknown to the IJN, the harbor entrance was widened many years earlier and even if the IJN had sunk a battleship in the harbor inlet, sideways, it would have made no difference, it was wide enough for ships to pass. They did not know this due to old harbor maps. There is far more to this complex story.

Air bases have similar needs. Geography and geology are vital for air bases. In Europe, there was an extensive road and railway network, flat ground and pre-existing air bases and commercial airports. Western Russia, Germany, Italy, France, Great Britain and even into the Eastern Europe area, these excellent bases were available. Concrete and asphalt runways, hangars, taxiways etc. were all available.

However, in the South Pacific, forget all this except for Australia, Port Moresby and Rabaul. The rest of the islands were mountainous, wet climates and with poor drainage they were nightmares to build and maintain good runways, infrastructure such as taxiways, ordnance dumps, fuel depots and barracks along with maintenance areas. Some runways were graded and topped with crushed coral and then the steel mats, named Marston Mats were installed. While they probably helped win the War in the Pacific, they were very difficult to land and takeoff from, but were easy to replace. The Japanese never had such mats. Another issue in the South Pacific was disease. Malaria, trench foot etc. All were debilitating and reduced air crews, maintenance and everyone. My mother told me of my dad's malaria after the war and I saw his trench foot, it was hideous. All these and more have to be dealt with in areas like the South Pacific. The North African desert had its own problems. One two lane highway for thousands of miles, sand, dust storms, and poor water. This made air bases very difficult to build, maintain and use.

Anyway, I hope I haven’t bored you, but I thought this was important to explain in my confused sort of way.

I have a book written by former Japanese officers and one essay does have an explanation of major Japanese naval yards. I will provide the source when finished.

The oldest naval base was Yokosuka Naval Base and it played a big part in Japanese naval history. It is located on a peninsula which leads to Tokyo. Yokohama is between the two locations. Its basic organization has features of all Japanese Naval Bases.

Headquarters        Supply Section                       Prison Flying Corps
Guard Vessels       Ship Superintendent Section    Harbormaster
Communications Corps. Reserved Vessels            Naval Yard
Naval Barracks     Personnel Section                   Hospital
Defense Corps

The base also had a concentration of technical schools in the nearby area. One of the bases defects was that it was not big enough for a task force and with the large population areas nearby, secrecy was a problem. It was always under the menace of carrier aircraft attack due to its location. The IJN did not use it as a fleet operating base. Records show that four battleships, two battlecruisers, five carriers, eleven cruisers, thirty destroyers, thirty submarines and many other ships included two submarine tenders later converted to Shoho and Ryuho.

Unfortunately, it wasn’t until WW2 that a glaring defect was discovered. The base had no wharf capable of unloading and loading supplies from large freighters and a poor infrastructure, namely railroads and vehicle transportation to get the supplies to their required areas. As the war progressed, this glaring fault caused much grief especially later, when we started to bomb the base. Supplies are of no value if they must sit on the dock and wait for movement.

Well, that is Yokosuka Naval Base. My next base will probably be Kure.

[garrisonchisholm]

Wow. Props Pops, love this info!

[oldpop2000]

Let’s take a brief look at the Kure Naval Yard, the greatest dockyard in Japan and the largest arsenal. It had heavy industries manufacturing steel armor, and large-caliber guns, including the 18-inch guns of the Yamato’s. It had the largest stocks of ammunition and fuel, so it was, by far the biggest and most important base. It was on the other side of peninsula from Hiroshima Bay, which was suitable for small craft maneuvering and this is where the submarine school was located and training accomplished. An Air Wing was established in 1932 and a telecommunications center in 1937.

The main fleet anchorage was not in Kure, but Hiroshima Bay which was larger and were not really exposed to view. Ships built in the Naval Yard were Akagi, Fuso, Atago, Chitose, Chuyo, Ibuki, Mogami, Nachi, Nagato, Nisshin, Oyodo, Settsu, Soryu and Yamato. As one can see, it was an extensive yard and many of the most important ships were built at Kure.


Let’s turn our attention to Sasebo Naval Base. This base has been a strategic local for Japan forever. It is very important since it essentially borders the East China Sea and the Yellow Sea. It was the primary base for combat operations in the Sino-Japanese War and the Russo-Japanese War. The conversion of the Akagi and Kaga to carriers was accomplished in the Sasebo Naval Arsenal. It built the Agano, Akashi, Kitakami, Kuma, Mutsuki, Nagara, Tatsuta, Yahagi, Yubari, Yura and Yukikaze.

Note: I am having difficulty deriving information on the number of drydocks and slips on the Japanese shipyards and naval arsenal, but I will keep looking. I am certain it is out there, I just have to have time to find it.

[oldpop2000]

I thought I would add this map of shipbuilding sites in the Japan during the war. It is from an official naval document I have. 

[bcoopactual]

So, I'm working on the UK right now. I haven't found a source equivalent to shipbuildinghistory.com so for now I'm just using Wikipedia. Since this is really just for immersion and background I don't want to spend a lot of money on hard copy books. (I would need two Conways books since they are split up 1860-1906 and 1907-1921.)

I'm using the same basic format I did for the USA. I'm thinking of using 1st class, 2nd class and maybe 3rd class instead of C for protected cruisers and ACR for armored cruisers since the Brits spent a considerable portion of that time period building huge protected cruisers instead of armored cruisers. Then I'll switch to CL and CA for light and heavy cruisers for the appropriate classes.

[oldpop2000]

Aug 13, 2018 5:59:00 GMT -6 bcoopactual said:

So, I'm working on the UK right now. I haven't found a source equivalent to shipbuildinghistory.com so for now I'm just using Wikipedia. Since this is really just for immersion and background I don't want to spend a lot of money on hard copy books. (I would need two Conways books since they are split up 1860-1906 and 1907-1921.)

I'm using the same basic format I did for the USA. I'm thinking of using 1st class, 2nd class and maybe 3rd class instead of C for protected cruisers and ACR for armored cruisers since the Brits spent a considerable portion of that time period building huge protected cruisers instead of armored cruisers. Then I'll switch to CL and CA for light and heavy cruisers for the appropriate classes.

The best source I’ve found on the British Shipyards is “The Battleship Builders: Constructing and Arming British Capital Ships” by Ian Johnston and Ian Buxton. This book is very detailed about the all the British shipyards.

Also, see if there is anything on this link at Internet Archive that can help you. archive.org/search.php?query=British%20Shipbuilding&sin=TXT

[Bürkner]

Hello fellow admirals,
here is a small excel-file about the german shipbuilding.
For the ships the year indicate the laying down of the keel; for the boats it is the year of the launching.

Schiffbau.xls (22.5 KB)