Feature request - scheduled submarine builds

[kyle]

I did not see this previously posted so forgive me if it's already been suggested.  I would like a feature added where I can set a scheduled submarine build each turn.  Particularly in wartime I want to tell my shipyards to build some number of subs.  I forget to build them - busy war fighting!

[rimbecano]

It would probably be best to have a dialog to confirm this every turn, just so that the player doesn't forget to turn it off, or accidentally end up in the red, but, yes, a very good idea.

[Adseria]

Something else that would be nice would be the ability to automatically replace lost submarines.

[garrisonchisholm]

Mm, so to set your nation's submarine level and keep it there.

It would need a prompt, like - "Confirm 8 [Coastal Submarines] be laid down to replace those missing in action?" In bigger wars I have had 15, 18 lost in a month, I wouldn't want those expenses automatically made for me.

[kyle]

I was thinking of something like being able to plan builds ahead of time for - say a year out? I can always cancel builds or build more. I would not want auto replacement necessarily as you're right - if they're dying too fast I may want to expend my Quatloos elsewhere (dating myself there - wonder who knows the reference?).

[director]

Quatloos are only useful when visiting Triskellion, which - because of the Galactic Travel Advisory from the Ferengi Gaming Commission - we cannot recommend.

Dating yourself is only proper in this age of Covid... Oh! You mean, 'giving away your age'! My mistake.



I can't remember losing more than 8 subs in a turn, but then again I don't build that many. Often I queue up 2 per turn and stop construction before the first ones launch, giving me 32 'in the pipeline' against expected wartime losses. The ability to set up a production line and just approve the builds each turn would be very helpful. Good suggestion, kyle and rimbecano and garrisonchisholm.

[oldpop2000]

Warship construction and funding should occur before the fiscal year starts. For the US Navy, that's October 1st. The planning, design and approval has to take place at least a year ahead or more, then the funding is put into the naval budget for the number of ships to be built in that year. All navies funded that way, so maybe the whole budget issue in the game needs to be revised. Aircraft construction occurs in the same way.

The other budget issue besides research and development is Operations & Maintenance, Navy. This funds the cost of operating and maintaining equipment. It includes many different efforts.

Base funding and improvements are in the same budget. I believe the budgeting issue in the game needs to be revised.

[dizzy]

Mar 11, 2020 8:23:48 GMT -6 oldpop2000 said:

Warship construction and funding should occur before the fiscal year starts. For the US Navy, that's October 1st. The planning, design and approval has to take place at least a year ahead or more, then the funding is put into the naval budget for the number of ships to be built in that year. All navies funded that way, so maybe the whole budget issue in the game needs to be revised. Aircraft construction occurs in the same way.

The other budget issue besides research and development is Operations & Maintenance, Navy. This funds the cost of operating and maintaining equipment. It includes many different efforts.

Base funding and improvements are in the same budget. I believe the budgeting issue in the game needs to be revised.

Well, I’m sure the USA took another look at their appropriations after they lost eighteen ships, including five battleships in the sneak attack on Pearl Harbor.

[oldpop2000]

Mar 11, 2020 10:20:30 GMT -6 dizzy said:

Mar 11, 2020 8:23:48 GMT -6 oldpop2000 said:

Warship construction and funding should occur before the fiscal year starts. For the US Navy, that's October 1st. The planning, design and approval has to take place at least a year ahead or more, then the funding is put into the naval budget for the number of ships to be built in that year. All navies funded that way, so maybe the whole budget issue in the game needs to be revised. Aircraft construction occurs in the same way.

The other budget issue besides research and development is Operations & Maintenance, Navy. This funds the cost of operating and maintaining equipment. It includes many different efforts.

Base funding and improvements are in the same budget. I believe the budgeting issue in the game needs to be revised.

Well, I’m sure the USA took another look at their appropriations after they lost eighteen ships, including five battleships in the sneak attack on Pearl Harbor.

No, the Naval Act of 1938, commonly known as the Second Vinson Act had already been ordered which was to build a two ocean navy. Of the five battleships hit at Pearl, only Oklahoma and Arizona were completely destroyed. Nevada was sent to Bremerton for upgrades and repairs. She was back in service by the end of 1942. The Pennsylvania, Tennessee and Maryland were back in service within two weeks. The other ships were generally repaired and back in service. The loss of 2400 men was more important. All the aircraft lost were replaced in fifteen days at the 1941 aircraft production rate. In 1943, that would have been fifteen minutes. We were way ahead of the Japanese. The fast battleships were either fitting out, or training. The first Essex was available in February 1943. So, no, we did not take another look at appropriations. Remember, we were trying to help the Allies in Europe so we were already building better destroyers and cruisers.

[dizzy]

Mar 11, 2020 12:01:58 GMT -6 oldpop2000 said:

Mar 11, 2020 10:20:30 GMT -6 dizzy said:

Well, I’m sure the USA took another look at their appropriations after they lost eighteen ships, including five battleships in the sneak attack on Pearl Harbor.

No, the Naval Act of 1938, commonly known as the Second Vinson Act had already been ordered which was to build a two ocean navy. Of the five battleships hit at Pearl, only Oklahoma and Arizona were completely destroyed. Nevada was sent to Bremerton for upgrades and repairs. She was back in service by the end of 1942. The Pennsylvania, Tennessee and Maryland were back in service within two weeks. The other ships were generally repaired and back in service. The loss of 2400 men was more important. All the aircraft lost were replaced in fifteen days at the 1941 aircraft production rate. In 1943, that would have been fifteen minutes. We were way ahead of the Japanese. The fast battleships were either fitting out, or training. The first Essex was available in February 1943. So, no, we did not take another look at appropriations. Remember, we were trying to help the Allies in Europe so we were already building better destroyers and cruisers.

Then I guess this never happened? O.o



On February 20th, 1942, Congress passed unanimously with a 371-0 vote, the largest appropriations bill in history to date. $32,762,737,900 of war funds were approved for all the armed services and civilian support for the war effort against the Empire of Japan and the forces of Germany and Italy.

“Never in all history has a nation been faced with the war costs of the magnitude that confront us; the amounts are appalling,” said Rep. Clarence Cannon. 

“Let us consider but one objective, and that objective is to win the war,” said Rep. Woodrum.

That's why budgets go up when you declare war in RTW, oldpop2000. Nations want to win the war, so they buy stuff to do it with. Just like I said above. That's why your budget idea for being set every October of the year is a bad idea. Budgets are fluid and spending appropriations bills can land on the Presidents desk at any time, day or night.

[oldpop2000]

Mar 11, 2020 16:47:05 GMT -6 dizzy said:

Mar 11, 2020 12:01:58 GMT -6 oldpop2000 said:

No, the Naval Act of 1938, commonly known as the Second Vinson Act had already been ordered which was to build a two ocean navy. Of the five battleships hit at Pearl, only Oklahoma and Arizona were completely destroyed. Nevada was sent to Bremerton for upgrades and repairs. She was back in service by the end of 1942. The Pennsylvania, Tennessee and Maryland were back in service within two weeks. The other ships were generally repaired and back in service. The loss of 2400 men was more important. All the aircraft lost were replaced in fifteen days at the 1941 aircraft production rate. In 1943, that would have been fifteen minutes. We were way ahead of the Japanese. The fast battleships were either fitting out, or training. The first Essex was available in February 1943. So, no, we did not take another look at appropriations. Remember, we were trying to help the Allies in Europe so we were already building better destroyers and cruisers.

Then I guess this never happened? O.o



On February 20th, 1942, Congress passed unanimously with a 371-0 vote, the largest appropriations bill in history to date. $32,762,737,900 of war funds were approved for all the armed services and civilian support for the war effort against the Empire of Japan and the forces of Germany and Italy.

“Never in all history has a nation been faced with the war costs of the magnitude that confront us; the amounts are appalling,” said Rep. Clarence Cannon. 

“Let us consider but one objective, and that objective is to win the war,” said Rep. Woodrum.

That's why budgets go up when you declare war in RTW, oldpop2000 . Nations want to win the war, so they buy stuff to do it with. Just like I said above. That's why your budget idea for being set every October of the year is a bad idea. Budgets are fluid and spending appropriations bills can land on the Presidents desk at any time, day or night.

The Emergency War Appropriations Bill of the 77th Congress was a continuation of legislation enacted during the previous 18 months, before the war had been declared. It did nothing more than raise the total war spending program authorized since mid-1940 when the rearmament program was started. So, in fact, this legislation was already an active budget long before February 20th, 1942. Yes, it was an increase but nothing that hadn't been decided before the fiscal year started in October 1st of 1941. The US government had already planned and allocated the necessary funding, it just had not requested it yet. It had to wait to see what the Axis powers were going to do. If Hitler and Mussolini had not declared war, the funding would have been less. 

My idea is that the game will allow you to plan a budget during peacetime for naval construction, training etc. Now, if war comes, you will be given more money. The game already does that, you get increased funding when war starts. 

[dizzy]

Mar 11, 2020 17:31:25 GMT -6 oldpop2000 said:

Yes it was an increase...

Glad you now agree with my original statement you said no to:

Mar 11, 2020 10:20:30 GMT -6 dizzy said:

Well, I’m sure the USA took another look at their appropriations after they lost eighteen ships, including five battleships in the sneak attack on Pearl Harbor.

On Feb. 20th, 1942, the USA took another look at their appropriations as I said I was sure, and they did. I'm also right about your bad idea that budgets need a revolution in implementation. It's just a bad idea. I really don't want to be the one to explain how FDR took us off the gold standard and what it did for military appropriations. It was a cheat. It was a power play from the feds to inflate the money supply. The more you have, the more you can spend. And spend they did.

[fredsanford]

This is a naval combat and warship design game, not Fiscal Management Simulator (r). Reworking the budgeting system to precisely reflect the myriad procurement procedures used by differing nations at different times is a poor use of (very limited i.e. one person that also has a day job) programmer time and effort IMO.

My (completely unofficial) opinion on the OP's request is simply be a less forgetful player. If you want subs, order them. If you forget, too bad.

[oldpop2000]

Mar 11, 2020 17:54:37 GMT -6 fredsanford said:

This is a naval combat and warship design game, not Fiscal Management Simulator (r). Reworking the budgeting system to precisely reflect the myriad procurement procedures used by differing nations at different times is a poor use of (very limited i.e. one person that also has a day job) programmer time and effort IMO.

My (completely unofficial) opinion on the OP's request is simply be a less forgetful player. If you want subs, order them. If you forget, too bad.

I cannot argue with your points, to me, the game is just fine. I don't want to get into fiscal management of the Navy department, I spent too many years having to deal with the ups and downs of Congressional financing. As you said, you want subs, order them. I do this on a regular basis in the game. I don't need the game to do it for me.

[dizzy]

Mar 11, 2020 17:31:25 GMT -6 oldpop2000 said:

My idea is that the game will allow you to plan a budget during peacetime for naval construction, training etc. Now, if war comes, you will be given more money. The game already does that, you get increased funding when war starts. 

Yes. I already said that. You said something to the effect that budgets need to be fixed every October. I disagree.

Are you inferring that builds (ships/subs/aircraft) need to be appropriated by October and they are fixed budget assets until more money is appropriated which would be represented by a war declaration? I just dont see that being workable. If that's what you mean, and that's what I'm disagreeing with, then why would it be better than how it's currently implemented?

The monthly budgets work just fine for me to be able to tinker with my naval procurements as the months go on and I see where things need to be spent.