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Post by JagdFlanker on Nov 30, 2016 18:29:32 GMT -6
while my dock size is increasing i never build more than 1 or 2 of any BC class since i want the latest tech and heaviest armour at any given time - i don't mind paying the full development cost every time i lay down a new BC this is the first BC i build in game, about 1903-ish when i get level 2 ship design. since ships are making pretty big tech jumps from design to design for the first 15 years, i retire my early ships pretty quick - this guy might last to 1910, maybe a little longer if i'm not doing as well. i'd rather free up the maintenance cost to build a brand new ship i NEVER EVER get turret explosions, even though i'v always played with reduced flash fires unchecked - my ships only sink when they get pounded into the ocean with steel or get hit by torps I assume you're not playing on historical budget (and have a turret flash fire trauma).
never tried historical budget, but i play mostly A-H which has one of the smallest budgets for the challenge (and oil) it's been implied several times that i put on too much turret armour, but whenever i try and reduce it *ka-blammo* one of my BC gets sunk EVERY TIME lol
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Post by director on Nov 30, 2016 20:41:21 GMT -6
Getting secondary director tech is one reason I keep my semi-dreadnoughts around - they're more useful than no dreadnought at all. Isn't that a long time to keep them around considering how much faster it is to get 8 or 9 main guns then it is to get secondary director? I don't keep them around as main-force ships, but as chips to add to the pot when I need more force at an enemy colony. Sometimes they even see action - my last US game saw three of my old semi's given mission after mission in South-east Asia. Germany had shipped a couple of older BCs there and I didn't have any capital ships to spare from the blockade in Europe. Funny thing - I couldn;t catch his BCs but they wouldn't stand and fight. Usually I'd get in a couple of hits and they'd run for port, letting me pick up a couple of VPs for the mission.
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rdfox
New Member
Posts: 23
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Post by rdfox on Dec 27, 2016 9:21:11 GMT -6
Personally, I've found semi-dreads to be useful for two things:
1) Being murderballs during the transition era to true dreads, and 2) Ruining people's days as colonial beasts in the late-game.
Generally, I end up building a class of semi-dread Bs and a class of semi-dread early BCs, and retain them well into the 30s, having been converted to colonial gunboats and kept in reserve status in peacetime; sometimes, I'll also build a class of semi-dread BBs or build one in place of the Bs, particularly if I get three centerline turrets quickly.
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Post by qossuth on Jan 21, 2017 6:51:43 GMT -6
It's my belief that secondary batteries are allowed end-on fire -- I've scored hits from secondaries firing on ships directly ahead of me. If this is in fact true, it's possible that large caliber secondaries in fore/aft wing positions have greater arcs of fire than primaries placed in exactly the same positions. Which might make semi-Dreadmoughts more valuable than they might appear on first blush.
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Roumba
Junior Member
Posts: 88
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Post by Roumba on Jan 21, 2017 9:57:16 GMT -6
If I have 0" of secondary armor on a ship, but DO have an armored deck, are casemated secondaries better protected from splinters,etc. than ones in turrets because they are "under" the deck?
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Post by bcoopactual on Jan 21, 2017 10:20:57 GMT -6
What kind of ship and sloping or flat deck?
Sloping deck or protected cruiser I would say definitely no because the armored deck slopes down underneath the casemates. Flat deck is a possibility but I can't answer for sure one way or another.
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Post by boomboomf22 on Jan 21, 2017 16:25:36 GMT -6
Also 0" armor on a heavy secondary battery ship is a real bad idea. One secondary hit and blammo, no more ship
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Post by director on Jan 21, 2017 18:19:35 GMT -6
One of the interesting things about the recent succession game of RtW as France, played by TheHistoricalGamer, XTRG and TortugaPower was the chat session afterwards where they talked about their very different ship design philosophies. One big difference was in armor for secondary guns - one favored a flat 2" and another went as high as 6". I suppose your choice would depend on how many times you've had a ship blown up...
For myself, I always use armor on my capital ship secondary turrets. If it is a semi-dreadnought with, say, mixed 12" and 10" armament I make sure the 10" turrets get at least 6.5-7". For anti-torpedo batteries of 4" or 5" guns, I'll go the caliber of the gun (4" or 5") or .5" less. I'd rather pack more barrels in and use a lighter caliber, so I never use 6" secondaries on a capital ship.
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Post by bcoopactual on Jan 21, 2017 18:20:08 GMT -6
Roumba , I can't be sure that the game models this historically without confirmation from the developers but looking at this picture for the Nevada, it seems like even the flat armored deck is installed below the level of the casemates so my guess is the armored deck doesn't provide splinter protection for casemates regardless of the type of deck. More modern WW2 designs that have multiple armored decks (Main, bomb, splinter, etc) might but I doubt it is modeled so in game.
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Post by joebob73 on Jan 21, 2017 18:44:34 GMT -6
One of the interesting things about the recent succession game of RtW as France, played by TheHistoricalGamer, XTRG and TortugaPower was the chat session afterwards where they talked about their very different ship design philosophies. One big difference was in armor for secondary guns - one favored a flat 2" and another went as high as 6". I suppose your choice would depend on how many times you've had a ship blown up... For myself, I always use armor on my capital ship secondary turrets. If it is a semi-dreadnought with, say, mixed 12" and 10" armament I make sure the 10" turrets get at least 6.5-7". For anti-torpedo batteries of 4" or 5" guns, I'll go the caliber of the gun (4" or 5") or .5" less. I'd rather pack more barrels in and use a lighter caliber, so I never use 6" secondaries on a capital ship. I'll usually go for 4-5" secondaries as soon as possible, because that allows me to use the 2" of armor required for HE/splinter protection without risking a detonation. I just never get the use that I want out of heavy secondaries, due to their dismal accuracy. And I tend to scrap pre-dreads as soon as feasible, because they are more vulnerable to torpedo-induced magazine detonations, as well as seeming to take more flooding damage.
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Post by beastro on Jan 21, 2017 22:52:03 GMT -6
One of the interesting things about the recent succession game of RtW as France, played by TheHistoricalGamer, XTRG and TortugaPower was the chat session afterwards where they talked about their very different ship design philosophies. One big difference was in armor for secondary guns - one favored a flat 2" and another went as high as 6". I suppose your choice would depend on how many times you've had a ship blown up... For myself, I always use armor on my capital ship secondary turrets. If it is a semi-dreadnought with, say, mixed 12" and 10" armament I make sure the 10" turrets get at least 6.5-7". For anti-torpedo batteries of 4" or 5" guns, I'll go the caliber of the gun (4" or 5") or .5" less. I'd rather pack more barrels in and use a lighter caliber, so I never use 6" secondaries on a capital ship. My thing atm is toying with a small number of medium caliber ones, 7-10in but mostly 8 inchers. It allows my ships to have 24 tertiaries of 3-6 inch since I learned that tertiaries have no limiting firing archs and can fire in any direction all at once making them more flexible in the anti-destroyer role while my cap ships have some larger battery, even if small, in case they run out of ammo.
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Post by boomboomf22 on Jan 22, 2017 2:16:53 GMT -6
One of the interesting things about the recent succession game of RtW as France, played by TheHistoricalGamer, XTRG and TortugaPower was the chat session afterwards where they talked about their very different ship design philosophies. One big difference was in armor for secondary guns - one favored a flat 2" and another went as high as 6". I suppose your choice would depend on how many times you've had a ship blown up... For myself, I always use armor on my capital ship secondary turrets. If it is a semi-dreadnought with, say, mixed 12" and 10" armament I make sure the 10" turrets get at least 6.5-7". For anti-torpedo batteries of 4" or 5" guns, I'll go the caliber of the gun (4" or 5") or .5" less. I'd rather pack more barrels in and use a lighter caliber, so I never use 6" secondaries on a capital ship. I'll usually go for 4-5" secondaries as soon as possible, because that allows me to use the 2" of armor required for HE/splinter protection without risking a detonation. I just never get the use that I want out of heavy secondaries, due to their dismal accuracy. And I tend to scrap pre-dreads as soon as feasible, because they are more vulnerable to torpedo-induced magazine detonations, as well as seeming to take more flooding damage. Interesting this, as I usually do a 6", 4" split, tho I suspect that comes from how much I play Germans with their crap 5"ers. I've also gotten strangely good use out of the usually useless 7" gun as a secondary battery on my predreads in my current game as Russia. Tore up the French and German Bs I've fought so far. I sank one of the French ones with just accumulated BE damage from a early CA armed with 14 7", 15 6" and 14 5" guns
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Post by Fredrik W on Jan 22, 2017 15:00:37 GMT -6
Roumba , I can't be sure that the game models this historically without confirmation from the developers but looking at this picture for the Nevada, it seems like even the flat armored deck is installed below the level of the casemates so my guess is the armored deck doesn't provide splinter protection for casemates regardless of the type of deck. More modern WW2 designs that have multiple armored decks (Main, bomb, splinter, etc) might but I doubt it is modeled so in game. I checked this. If secondary guns are unarmoured, it assumes there is no top armour either. If there is any SEC armour the game uses DE as top armour for secondary guns. Not ideal perhaps, and I will change that for RTW2, but that's the way it works right now.
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Post by HolyDragoon on Jan 22, 2017 16:56:08 GMT -6
Wait, what if the ship uses a AoN scheme?
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Post by bcoopactual on Jan 22, 2017 17:42:11 GMT -6
Roumba , I can't be sure that the game models this historically without confirmation from the developers but looking at this picture for the Nevada, it seems like even the flat armored deck is installed below the level of the casemates so my guess is the armored deck doesn't provide splinter protection for casemates regardless of the type of deck. More modern WW2 designs that have multiple armored decks (Main, bomb, splinter, etc) might but I doubt it is modeled so in game. I checked this. If secondary guns are unarmoured, it assumes there is no top armour either. If there is any SEC armour the game uses DE as top armour for secondary guns. Not ideal perhaps, and I will change that for RTW2, but that's the way it works right now. Thank you for responding Fredrik. Doesn't sound to me like the game is far off the historical mark on this issue but I'm certainly not the expert here.
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