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Post by brygun on May 18, 2020 12:03:39 GMT -6
Once the secondary guns become dual purpose we start getting messages when a ship is at 50% AA ammo.
A natural question is can there be more ammo on a ship?
I think it could be done as a tick box in the design screen for normal or extra ammo.
A different option would be a drop down menu where there could now be a few choice like
reduced 75%
normal 100%
increased 150%
large 200%
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Post by smrfisher on May 21, 2020 18:59:55 GMT -6
I would like to second this, also increased number of shells would be very useful in pre-Dreadnoughts which are unable to hit the broadside of the barn from inside.
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Post by oldpop2000 on May 21, 2020 20:33:00 GMT -6
I put this suggestion up here a while ago. nws-online.proboards.com/thread/4788/rounds-gun-secondary-tertiary-gunsDuring peacetime, ships normally do not carry full loads of ammunition to save weight which is a fuel save. During wartime, that changes and their ammunition loads are increased. I believe that this is the proper historical way to handle ammunition loads. Possibly with a standard percentage increase during wartime. Example: A normal load of ammunition per gun is 150 rounds but during wartime, the load would increase by 30% or 45 rounds. |
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Post by wlbjork on May 22, 2020 7:50:44 GMT -6
I look at that as being part of the reason why the maintenance cost increases during wartime - ships are more active and so carry more fuel and fill magazines to capacity (also tend to have more manpower).
Deliberately carrying ammunition over and above that stored safely in magazines could be an option, coming with an increased risk of a flash fire destroying the warship.
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Post by slipstream on May 23, 2020 13:48:18 GMT -6
During peacetime, ships normally do not carry full loads of ammunition to save weight which is a fuel save. During wartime, that changes and their ammunition loads are increased. I believe that this is the proper historical way to handle ammunition loads. Possibly with a standard percentage increase during wartime. Example: A normal load of ammunition per gun is 150 rounds but during wartime, the load would increase by 30% or 45 rounds. Would this increase in ammo load affect the ship's speed in some way? If this is implemented, we should be able to carry more ammo than our magazine has storage for, but at a cost: an increased chance of losing speed, and a higher risk of a magazine explosion, as wlbjork said. Maybe for every 10% increase above maximum magazine capacity (up to 50%), there is a 5% chance of losing 1kn of speed, and a 10% greater chance of suffering a magazine explosion or fire, until ammo levels drop below the ship's magazine capacity. Once the secondary guns become dual purpose we start getting messages when a ship is at 50% AA ammo. A natural question is can there be more ammo on a ship? I think it could be done as a tick box in the design screen for normal or extra ammo. A different option would be a drop down menu where there could now be a few choice like reduced 75% normal 100% increased 150% large 200% To follow up on brygun 's idea, a ship should be designed with two kinds of magazine storage spaces: one for main gun ammo, and one for secondary/tertiary gun ammo. I know they do have separate magazines; I want secondary magazines that we have control over. To elaborate on his idea, we should be able to specify whether we want small, normal, or large magazine areas on each ship - again keeping the main gun and secondary/tertiary gun selections separate. Main/secondary gun magazine capacities might be**: Gun calibers - main/secondary
12"+ 8"-11" 5"-7" 2"-4" mn/sd mn/sd mn/sd mn/sd
Small 100 150 200/150 200/150
Medium 200 250 350/300 400/300
Large 300 400 500/450 600/500 ** (I realize that magazine capacities are probably also determined by the caliber size of the gun they're serving, not just whether they are serving a main gun or a secondary gun, so I broke it down into gun calibers, to clarify the idea. The chart above is not based on any real facts, but just to make a point.  )
If a ship is designed with small magazines, then it's chance of a magazine explosion or fire should go down by 20% (it's harder to hit). On the other hand, if a ship is designed with large magazines, then it's chance of a magazine explosion or fire should go up by 20% or so. A small magazine should take up less weight and space on a ship than a medium one, and much less weight and space than a large one (less armor-plating).
So, in the early days before aircraft and fast deadly destroyers, you could build a ship with a large main gun magazine and a small secondary gun magazine. And then when naval aviation starts hitting its peak, you could build your warships with a smaller main gun magazine and a large secondary gun magazine - effectively tripling their AA ammo, and you would never having to worry about running out. Obviously, it would be impractical, if not outright impossible, to design a 1200tn destroyer mounting two 4"/5" guns with large magazines, but you could design a light cruiser with such, or wait for when you acquire 2500tn destroyers. I think that this idea would be especially useful for designing AA light cruisers like the Atlanta, and would, hopefully, make them a formidable weapon against airstrikes.
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Post by smrfisher on May 24, 2020 8:53:43 GMT -6
During peacetime, ships normally do not carry full loads of ammunition to save weight which is a fuel save. During wartime, that changes and their ammunition loads are increased. I believe that this is the proper historical way to handle ammunition loads. Possibly with a standard percentage increase during wartime. Example: A normal load of ammunition per gun is 150 rounds but during wartime, the load would increase by 30% or 45 rounds. The problem with trying to equate this as a 'historical' example is that when at war navies would fill magazines to their designed maximum capacity. When at peace they would have considerably reduced load out to save on cost, weight and concerns such as having to offload ammunition before entering certain points. In game when you design your ship you are stipulating the full load displacement, and the designed maximum magazine capacity, not some peacetime load out which can be arbitrarily increased. Given that in game you don't have the same concerns regarding ship supply and logistics as happened in period your example is anything but 'the proper historical way' to act. |
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Post by nobody on May 26, 2020 8:42:24 GMT -6
Once the secondary guns become dual purpose we start getting messages when a ship is at 50% AA ammo. I've noticed this happens with my battleships after a single air attack. Very annoying. The reason is quite simple though: it only carries 75 rounds per gun (4" tertiary)! Looking at reals ship for comparison: Bismarck carried 1800 rounds for her 15cm(6") secondaries (150 per gun) and 6270 round for her 105mm(4.1") AA guns (almost 392 rounds per gun). Hood carried 3500 round for her 4" AA guns (250 per gun). Luckily we don't have to worry about the ammo for the lighter AA guns. |
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