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Post by dorn on Jun 10, 2019 10:46:24 GMT -6
This is something what I would like to know. How much CAP is used when choosing between heavy, medium etc. level.
If I have more large carriers I have found that maximum CAP is not needed. It is needed mainly in enclosed seas where you expect heavy strikes against your force.
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Post by chaosblade on Jun 10, 2019 12:21:25 GMT -6
in my current game I am seeing a lot of focus by the AI towards subs, all great powers seem to have in excess to 100 subs, mind I was playing USA and had to call quits an a war against the UK because I was being subjected to a death of a thousand cuts... that was before I started building 900t DD, more inline with DDEEs 28knt speed, a single central torpedo tubes, three 5" guns and as much ASW as I could cram in those, (so 4 K-guns, extra DCs and forward mortars in their refit) but I guess that is how the cookie crumbled, I have too much of a surface fleet and far more budget than anybody else so nobody is even trying to directly challenge me and, thus, subs
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jatzi
Full Member
Posts: 123
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Post by jatzi on Jun 11, 2019 4:28:35 GMT -6
This is something what I would like to know. How much CAP is used when choosing between heavy, medium etc. level.
If I have more large carriers I have found that maximum CAP is not needed. It is needed mainly in enclosed seas where you expect heavy strikes against your force.
In that battle I described when I had heavy CAP it used almost all my fighters. In a fleet carrier and two light carriers I had 172 aircraft with 60 of them being fighters, I think since this is all from memory. The carriers were under my control but set to support a separate BC force so they split their CAP between the two forces. I probably had 20-30 fighters over my BC's and like 20 fighters over my carriers which leaves like 10 fighters for escort duty. And aircraft still got through, although one time they got through was only because my fighters were refueling and rearming. At medium CAP I usually have quite a few fighters left over for escort duty so theres a definite increase and in a carrier duel where you're expecting heavy enemy strikes I'd say go with heavy CAP. You can always delay a strike if you really want escorts. Also yeah I saw 100+ subs in my USA game too. I just whittled them away until they had none left but then neither did I so.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Jun 25, 2019 15:24:43 GMT -6
Let me kick this thread up again- have there been any recent crazy carrier v carrier cataclysmic contests? :]
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Post by rodentnavy on Jun 25, 2019 15:52:47 GMT -6
Let me kick this thread up again- have there been any recent crazy carrier v carrier cataclysmic contests? :] I had the opposite in my v1.04-1.05 campaign. The Americans turned up with the greater part of their carrier fleet off Harwich carrying more planes than the British had locally....and then managed to lose 5 of their light and fleet carriers in a night action with even an MTB getting in a hit. The plan was brilliant in conception and elegant in design but the execution was a little....off. There was some carrier on carrier action throughout the next day that only saw the Wasp get torpedoed, which hurt her pride and made her limp a bit so far as I can tell.
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Post by mycophobia on Jun 25, 2019 16:06:13 GMT -6
I will eventually have get to it in my Russian AAR, but I've had a battle where I tried to airstrike the opposing carrier over a ongoing fleet line battle. Obviously planes from both side met halfway over the fleet battle and fought inconclusively. Meanwhile battle cruiser/Heavy cruiser squadron from both sides manage to get around the otherside's battleline and sunk the opposing carriers I got the short end of the stick, but it was pretty wild and fun. (This was early 30s, with varied tech making aircraft seems a little worse than they should be)
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Jun 25, 2019 16:09:19 GMT -6
I will eventually have get to it in my Russian AAR, but I've had a battle where I tried to airstrike the opposing carrier over a ongoing fleet line battle. Obviously planes from both side met halfway over the fleet battle and fought inconclusively. Meanwhile battle cruiser/Heavy cruiser squadron from both sides manage to get around the otherside's battleline and sunk the opposing carriers I got the short end of the stick, but it was pretty wild and fun. (This was early 30s, with varied tech making aircraft seems a little worse than they should be) ...I'm not sure if I think that is cool or terrible lol.
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Post by mycophobia on Jun 25, 2019 16:15:58 GMT -6
I will eventually have get to it in my Russian AAR, but I've had a battle where I tried to airstrike the opposing carrier over a ongoing fleet line battle. Obviously planes from both side met halfway over the fleet battle and fought inconclusively. Meanwhile battle cruiser/Heavy cruiser squadron from both sides manage to get around the otherside's battleline and sunk the opposing carriers I got the short end of the stick, but it was pretty wild and fun. (This was early 30s, with varied tech making aircraft seems a little worse than they should be) ...I'm not sure if I think that is cool or terrible lol. When the enemy BCs popped up besides my two poor CVLs I am actually thankful that they went around to the carriers rather than reinforcing the enemy line lol....
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Post by rob06waves2018 on Jun 25, 2019 17:01:41 GMT -6
I had a semi-true carrier engagement in a war as Britain against the US. My fleet was blockading NA East Coast and my only major ships in Northern Europe were 3 refitted 30,000t BBs and 3 brand new 150 a/c CVs. By a quirk of fate, they had sent over their entire fleet at the same time I had so we blockaded each other. I did not know this so accepted a fleet battle off the Bristol Channel. Boy, I regretted that click immediately. My 3 ancient BBs with their piddling 14" guns stood against 2 CVs, 6 BBs and 8 BCs. I ran. I can only imagine that uniform trousers became brown that day. I launched every thing that could load a bomb into the skies. TBs, DBs, fighters with bombs, even float planes from the BBs themselves. As soon as a flight returned, they were rearmed and in the air again as soon as possible. Land-based air sent periodic MB flights but not nearly as many. Eventually, I escaped with all 6 capital ships. I had even sunk 2 BCs, 1 BB and 1 CV in the process!
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Post by seawolf on Jun 25, 2019 18:29:25 GMT -6
Let me kick this thread up again- have there been any recent crazy carrier v carrier cataclysmic contests? :] I think I figured out the problem, maybe you can bump to the devs. Carrier battles are only triggered during battleship engagements, fleet battles, convoy attacks, or coastal raids as far as I can tell. Coastal Raids are most often one sided(carriers on one side) unless the other side spawns with battleships. Convoy attacks appear to be almost always one sided even if the other side has battleships. Both battleship engagements and fleet battles require a large battleship presence, and are not triggered if CVs are in a region without Battleship escort. As such no type of Carrier battle can occur without large amounts of battleships, making over the horizon carrier battles extremely rare as there is a much larger fleet of battleships between them. My suggestion is too either add a carrier battle type similar to cruiser or battleship engagements, where a there would be no main force, only a carrier force- or to allow CVs to spawn often in cruiser actions Invasions also can spawn CVs but these are too rare to matter.
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Post by arminpfano on Jun 26, 2019 0:19:58 GMT -6
My suggestion is too either add a carrier battle type similar to cruiser or battleship engagements, where a there would be no main force, only a carrier force- or to allow CVs to spawn often in cruiser actions
I would like to second this wish. I just had a war GER - USA in the 40ies, where I killed all their BBs and BCs within some months in conventional battles, some of them with carriers as support. But then I had no main encounter for nearly three years, even if USA had a couple of CV and CVL operational. So obviously they are not used by the battle generator solely.
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Post by generalvikus on Jun 26, 2019 7:43:32 GMT -6
My suggestion is too either add a carrier battle type similar to cruiser or battleship engagements, where a there would be no main force, only a carrier force- or to allow CVs to spawn often in cruiser actions
I would like to second this wish. I just had a war GER - USA in the 40ies, where I killed all their BBs and BCs within some months in conventional battles, some of them with carriers as support. But then I had no main encounter for nearly three years, even if USA had a couple of CV and CVL operational. So obviously they are not used by the battle generator solely.
Considering that carriers and naval aviation generally are the selling point and the focus of the game, it seems like an unlikely oversight. Far be it from me to dispute those who are more experienced with RTW2 than I, but we did see plenty of examples of 'real' carrier battles throughout the dev diaries, so perhaps there is a mechanism that is meant to be generating these battles which simply isn't working as intended?
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Post by williammiller on Jun 26, 2019 8:38:02 GMT -6
Let me kick this thread up again- have there been any recent crazy carrier v carrier cataclysmic contests? :] I think I figured out the problem, maybe you can bump to the devs. Carrier battles are only triggered during battleship engagements, fleet battles, convoy attacks, or coastal raids as far as I can tell. Coastal Raids are most often one sided(carriers on one side) unless the other side spawns with battleships. Convoy attacks appear to be almost always one sided even if the other side has battleships. Both battleship engagements and fleet battles require a large battleship presence, and are not triggered if CVs are in a region without Battleship escort. As such no type of Carrier battle can occur without large amounts of battleships, making over the horizon carrier battles extremely rare as there is a much larger fleet of battleships between them. My suggestion is too either add a carrier battle type similar to cruiser or battleship engagements, where a there would be no main force, only a carrier force- or to allow CVs to spawn often in cruiser actions Invasions also can spawn CVs but these are too rare to matter. We will look at this, thanks for the report seawolf
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Post by nuclearmoose on Jun 26, 2019 11:00:18 GMT -6
Just has a side note I dont think I have ever had to use light or even medium bomb load outside of my very early dive bombers, battles ranges are so short that I no longer even care about aircraft range.
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Post by garrisonchisholm on Jun 26, 2019 11:27:13 GMT -6
Just has a side note I dont think I have ever had to use light or even medium bomb load outside of my very early dive bombers, battles ranges are so short that I no longer even care about aircraft range. This is a valid point as well. Early on it was discussed how extended air-strike ranges would naturally bring about the end of the age of the surface ship, but as anyone can see that isn't yet a part of the game. Maintaining large battle-lines is a viable strategy currently for as late as one wishes to play.
Once battle selection becomes preferentially a 300 mile+ engagement, likely lasting into 2 days, then players would naturally begin to feel an investment into large battleships as a liability, or at least as an asset which tactics would be hard pressed to properly utilize.
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