jatzi
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Posts: 123
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Post by jatzi on Feb 22, 2021 15:10:33 GMT -6
Since helicopters will be added and AV's can be built as helicopter carriers, will there be other uses for helicopter carriers other than as an ASW platform? Well helicopters can carry ASM's, anti-ship missiles, but I imagine irl they're fairly easy to shoot down and wouldnt be crazy effective in ship to ship combat. I'm not sure though. Would be useful for convoy raiding though |
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Post by epigon on Feb 22, 2021 15:55:26 GMT -6
1 Task force creation - grouping AA cruisers/destroyers with your capital ships of choice
2 Manual player choice for museum ships - though the bar should be set high for this
3 Pride of the fleet and admiral’s flagship features for squadron command vessels
4 Dynamic system for Underdeveloped and Poor Education traits - continuous high investments, building+combat experience and domestic ship orders+dock sizes should after some time offset it - example - Historical budget Russia in 1920s with 80 000 dockyards and 5 won wars, 30 000 monthly naval budget is still apparently poor and underdeveloped
5 Not just Dockyard size - but numbers as well - to somehow model that building major capital ships in parallel was not common due to limited large drydock capacity
6 Reconstructions more open - allowing for Conte Cavour, Andrea Doria, Nagato and Kongo style total reconstructions.
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Post by flyingfortress15 on Feb 22, 2021 19:14:53 GMT -6
Will the USA be able to do something like the Spainish-American war?
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Post by dia on Feb 22, 2021 20:01:29 GMT -6
Since helicopters will be added and AV's can be built as helicopter carriers, will there be other uses for helicopter carriers other than as an ASW platform? Well helicopters can carry ASM's, anti-ship missiles, but I imagine irl they're fairly easy to shoot down and wouldnt be crazy effective in ship to ship combat. I'm not sure though. Would be useful for convoy raiding though I mean the specific class as a whole. For helicopter carriers I think their worth is more in the strategic aspect than in individual battles. I'm just wondering if they provide any other strategic or regional bonuses than just ASW. In the current ASW score system they wouldn't be much use if their only role was ASW. The current setup has diminishing returns for higher ASW scores which favors larger numbers of low ASW-score hulls. In that case, helicopter carriers would just be an expensive ship with a high asw score and would fall out of favor for most players like seaplane tenders did. I have nothing wrong with the seaplane tender, it works great as a scout platform alongside carriers. But the BG just almost never deploys them once carriers become a thing. |
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Post by imperatoraugust on Feb 22, 2021 20:45:25 GMT -6
1 Task force creation - grouping AA cruisers/destroyers with your capital ships of choice 2 Manual player choice for museum ships - though the bar should be set high for this 3 Pride of the fleet and admiral’s flagship features for squadron command vessels 4 Dynamic system for Underdeveloped and Poor Education traits - continuous high investments, building+combat experience and domestic ship orders+dock sizes should after some time offset it - example - Historical budget Russia in 1920s with 80 000 dockyards and 5 won wars, 30 000 monthly naval budget is still apparently poor and underdeveloped 5 Not just Dockyard size - but numbers as well - to somehow model that building major capital ships in parallel was not common due to limited large drydock capacity 6 Reconstructions more open - allowing for Conte Cavour, Andrea Doria, Nagato and Kongo style total reconstructions. This and AI wars is what I want. This DLC is cool idea, but I most likely will not be buying it because its just not what I want from the game. I think this game is going to fall into the War Thunder trap of trying to cover to much instead of really nailing it down. |
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jatzi
Full Member
Posts: 123
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Post by jatzi on Feb 22, 2021 22:12:51 GMT -6
Well helicopters can carry ASM's, anti-ship missiles, but I imagine irl they're fairly easy to shoot down and wouldnt be crazy effective in ship to ship combat. I'm not sure though. Would be useful for convoy raiding though I mean the specific class as a whole. For helicopter carriers I think their worth is more in the strategic aspect than in individual battles. I'm just wondering if they provide any other strategic or regional bonuses than just ASW. In the current ASW score system they wouldn't be much use if their only role was ASW. The current setup has diminishing returns for higher ASW scores which favors larger numbers of low ASW-score hulls. In that case, helicopter carriers would just be an expensive ship with a high asw score and would fall out of favor for most players like seaplane tenders did. I have nothing wrong with the seaplane tender, it works great as a scout platform alongside carriers. But the BG just almost never deploys them once carriers become a thing. Yeah that's actually really annoying. I try to keep an AV or two around even into the carrier age because of how useful they are for scouting and they just never show up. Incidentally I really enjoy using floatplane scouts in a naval attack role after the battle is joined. It's not super effective usually but I just love when I see a little floatplane score a hit with a bomb on something. Upon some reflection I actually think I'd get a similar kick out of seeing helicopters score the occasional hit as well amid the expected usual slaughter. What's also annoying is that AV's have serious trouble recovering floatplanes if they're sent on anything other than automatic scouting missions. In fact every ship does. They just circle until they die. |
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jatzi
Full Member
Posts: 123
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Post by jatzi on Feb 22, 2021 22:14:46 GMT -6
1 Task force creation - grouping AA cruisers/destroyers with your capital ships of choice 2 Manual player choice for museum ships - though the bar should be set high for this 3 Pride of the fleet and admiral’s flagship features for squadron command vessels 4 Dynamic system for Underdeveloped and Poor Education traits - continuous high investments, building+combat experience and domestic ship orders+dock sizes should after some time offset it - example - Historical budget Russia in 1920s with 80 000 dockyards and 5 won wars, 30 000 monthly naval budget is still apparently poor and underdeveloped 5 Not just Dockyard size - but numbers as well - to somehow model that building major capital ships in parallel was not common due to limited large drydock capacity 6 Reconstructions more open - allowing for Conte Cavour, Andrea Doria, Nagato and Kongo style total reconstructions. This and AI wars is what I want. This DLC is cool idea, but I most likely will not be buying it because its just not what I want from the game. I think this game is going to fall into the War Thunder trap of trying to cover to much instead of really nailing it down. If this is successful maybe they'll work on another one that fixes some of the issues we still have. Or they'll factor it into their next game whatever that is. Idk maybe not but who knows |
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Post by cdcool on Feb 22, 2021 22:27:49 GMT -6
Are you still forced to design your own ships and will there be scenarios where the ships are built already?
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w2c
Full Member
Posts: 178
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Post by w2c on Feb 22, 2021 23:46:50 GMT -6
Forced to design your own ships? That's basically the whole point of the game. Of course there's an auto gen you can use to have the AI do most of the work for you and all you'll have to do is correct any errors that occur. You could also get design ideas from various places here on the forums.  |
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Post by cdcool on Feb 22, 2021 23:52:38 GMT -6
Forced to design your own ships? That's basically the whole point of the game. Of course there's an auto gen you can use to have the AI do most of the work for you and all you'll have to do is correct any errors that occur. You could also get design ideas from various places here on the forums. Yeah I know and that sucks, I don't want to be forced to design or correct anything, I hope they change that. |
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w2c
Full Member
Posts: 178
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Post by w2c on Feb 23, 2021 0:21:39 GMT -6
Forced to design your own ships? That's basically the whole point of the game. Of course there's an auto gen you can use to have the AI do most of the work for you and all you'll have to do is correct any errors that occur. You could also get design ideas from various places here on the forums. Yeah I know and that sucks, I don't want to be forced to design or correct anything, I hope they change that. I can't speak for them by any stretch but I really don't see how they can put out a version of this game where that wouldn't be the case. |
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Post by seawolf on Feb 23, 2021 2:52:55 GMT -6
Are you still forced to design your own ships and will there be scenarios where the ships are built already? Have you played SAI? Its just RTW’s combat engine during WWI with pre-built ships |
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Post by tornado1555 on Feb 23, 2021 4:37:59 GMT -6
It's great to hear of this improvement to the game, and I look forward to it. I do have questions though that have to do with submarines. The designing and development process of submarines in RTW1, which this game is continuing with some improvements (strategic deployment), was acceptable for the scope of the game at that time. RTW2 has aimed to enhance not only the detail of the air dimension, but also has increased the timeline drastically. So drastically, in fact, that it reaches the point where submarines ceased to (mostly) be a mass produced unit and began to be "expensive to very expensive", often with vastly differing intended missions with lots of overlap. The submarine became generally a greater threat to the battle fleet and to itself through this time, far surpassing ASuW effectiveness even in early WWI, in exchange for an arguably moderate reduction in threat to convoys (given improvements to convoys and the increased cost of the submarine causing a reduction in numbers). How might this incredible naval and technological evolution be represented? With what little I know, by the end of the period we'd have SSNs, SKs, SSGNs, and SSBNs. So many different designs and advances. Towed arrays and the introduction of things like the ASW and wake-homing torpedo, or the Towed Array or Towed/Expendable Countermeasures. The transition from the brief period of mass production of u-boats to a future where half a dozen "Skipjack" or "November/Kit" class submarines may not be a change that can easily be represented with just a % effectiveness increase -- after the 1940s submarine patrol survivability seemed to go up greatly with a given crew quality, even as ASW and theoretical convoy/task force protection measures increased. So, to sum up my thoughts in a relatively concise way: -Would a greater "depth" [pun time] to submarine design and implementation be possible, including costs/maintenance? Without wrecking the AI? -How would you simulate the increase in submarine cost, but also survivability, command and control, and effectiveness, after the 1940s? -How would this be done without totally wrecking the currently abstracted convoy system of an opponent? --Or, worst of all, without forcing the game to be an abstracted "ASW rating" war with no tactical input for either fleet or sub? -How would Nuclear Power's introduction (and its loudness vs Diesel/Electrics), or the introduction of vast technological improvements (homing torpedo, towed array, countermeasures, etc.) be represented?
Also on that note, how might the "Nuclear Warship" be implemented, such as the Long Beach class?
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Post by janxol on Feb 23, 2021 6:41:21 GMT -6
Now my question with regards to AV and helocpter carriers would be: will we be able to put helicopters onto cruisers and other ships similarly to how we can do that with floatplanes?
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Post by williammiller on Feb 23, 2021 9:38:14 GMT -6
Now my question with regards to AV and helocpter carriers would be: will we be able to put helicopters onto cruisers and other ships similarly to how we can do that with floatplanes? That is something I will suggest to Fredrik W , its a logical step with the introduction of helo assets (he may already have this planned). |
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