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Post by cogsandspigots on Apr 13, 2020 10:07:13 GMT -6
So the choices of coastal batteries seem rather limited compared to real life.
First and foremost, I think that 15” guns and 16” guns in turrets should be an option. There’s plenty of historical precedence for coastal batteries of this size. A 15” battery defended Singapore during WW2, and the US coastline had dozens of 16” batteries from repurposed South Dakota (1920) guns.
Secondly, I think we should be able to do non-turreted large caliber coastal batteries. The aforementioned 16” coastal batteries in the US were in casemate mounts, not turrets. This is less important but would be a nice alternative to the expensive turret batteries.
Finally, and kind of a pipe dream, I would like coastal missile batteries to be introduced. Similar to the US Nike Ajax anti-aircraft batteries built in the early 1950s. But I understand if this one is outside the scope of the game.
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Post by potrero on Apr 14, 2020 21:31:52 GMT -6
San Diego Bay was defended by 16-inch guns on the cliffs of Point Loma. The bunkers are still there. The National Park Service maintains some of them.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Apr 14, 2020 21:57:53 GMT -6
San Diego Bay was defended by 16-inch guns on the cliffs of Point Loma. The bunkers are still there. The National Park Service maintains some of them. Those 16 inch guns were in Battery Ashburn - npshistory.com/publications/cabr/guns-san-diego-hrs/chap7.htmMany of the casemates and bunkers are now used by the Naval Electronics Lab or SPAWAR as it is now called. There is a sonar testing tank for testing the sonar arrays, I've been there a few times with my buddies testing the helicopter sonar arrays. I always enjoy going up to Point Loma and the seeing the bunkers. |
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Post by Antediluvian Monster on Apr 15, 2020 8:32:24 GMT -6
Japan also had old* 16 inch turrets from Nagatos as coastal artillery while Germany used both 16 and 15 inch.
*There really should be a way to convert scrapped ships into coastal artillery with discount since that's what much of it was.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Apr 15, 2020 8:55:55 GMT -6
After the USS Saratoga was torpedoed on January 11, 1942, she went into Pearl Harbor before heading to Bremerton for updates and repairs. At that time, they removed the 8 inch. guns and moved them to the coastal batteries. I don't think they are still there, according to my daughter.
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Post by seawolf on Apr 15, 2020 13:48:06 GMT -6
I think someone had suggested previously that guns and turrets be treated similarly to aircraft types, with production numbers and stockpiles, and that system might allow you to transfer guns to coastal batteries when you scrap or convert ships
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Post by dia on Apr 15, 2020 15:39:52 GMT -6
I think someone had suggested previously that guns and turrets be treated similarly to aircraft types, with production numbers and stockpiles, and that system might allow you to transfer guns to coastal batteries when you scrap or convert ships I like this idea. The Yamoto's secondary battery and the Oyodo's main battery were surplus turrets from when the Mogami's main batteries were upgunned. It would make a good opportunity to save costs and simulate some kind of standardization within the fleet. As long as it's only for 6inches and up and allows players to scrap the stockpiles for cash though (something that can't be done with aircraft stockpiles). |
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Post by oldpop2000 on Apr 15, 2020 15:52:26 GMT -6
Just a quick reminder that using obsolete guns from ships that are being scrapped means you are using older, worn-out guns possibly with poor construction from an earlier era. They probably will not have the range nor the reliability of newer guns. If you have to overhaul the guns, this will cost money. Now cost per performance takes hold. There is a lot more to removing guns from ships and placing in coastal batteries.
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Post by christian on Apr 16, 2020 1:08:33 GMT -6
I think someone had suggested previously that guns and turrets be treated similarly to aircraft types, with production numbers and stockpiles, and that system might allow you to transfer guns to coastal batteries when you scrap or convert ships believe that was me and well i might as well just advertise for my thread so yoink nws-online.proboards.com/thread/2626/more-depth-gun-customization-systemguns in game cost quite literally a shitton (its like 460 for a 20 inch barrel 360 for a 16 inch one) keeping them like what i wanted with my idea would be nice and save you a large bit of cash without just throwing out old gun barrels |
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Post by rob06waves2018 on Apr 16, 2020 2:23:21 GMT -6
Just a quick reminder that using obsolete guns from ships that are being scrapped means you are using older, worn-out guns possibly with poor construction from an earlier era. They probably will not have the range nor the reliability of newer guns. If you have to overhaul the guns, this will cost money. Now cost per performance takes hold. There is a lot more to removing guns from ships and placing in coastal batteries. Whilst you are quite right that they would be older, that doesn't necessarily make them obsolete, or even worse than your newest guns. Naval rifles had to be relined every x number of shots anyway, which I think we can assume is already abstracted in the maintenance cost of ships. This would hopefully then be included in the siting costs of the new battery. So the cost of repurposing is still going to be relatively low compared with building a brand new one. There are examples of times where old guns were perfectly viable with new linings. The main example of this would be HMS Vanguard. She used 15" guns that had been designed in the First World War and actively used on 4 different battleships. Even having to reline them and build new mountings was significantly easier and cheaper than building a brand new gun. |
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Post by trifler on Apr 16, 2020 3:03:01 GMT -6
The ideal would be to be able to design coastal batteries. We could choose guns from our available tech, turret type, armor, secondaries of 6" or less, etc. It would show us the production cost and the maintenance cost. These designs would not become old and require a refit after 10 years like ships, but we would be able to do a refit if we so choose to replace lower quality guns with higher quality guns, or to modify the secondaries. Changing the size of the main guns would require a new design.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Apr 16, 2020 7:36:11 GMT -6
Just a quick reminder that using obsolete guns from ships that are being scrapped means you are using older, worn-out guns possibly with poor construction from an earlier era. They probably will not have the range nor the reliability of newer guns. If you have to overhaul the guns, this will cost money. Now cost per performance takes hold. There is a lot more to removing guns from ships and placing in coastal batteries. Whilst you are quite right that they would be older, that doesn't necessarily make them obsolete, or even worse than your newest guns. Naval rifles had to be relined every x number of shots anyway, which I think we can assume is already abstracted in the maintenance cost of ships. This would hopefully then be included in the siting costs of the new battery. So the cost of repurposing is still going to be relatively low compared with building a brand new one. There are examples of times where old guns were perfectly viable with new linings. The main example of this would be HMS Vanguard. She used 15" guns that had been designed in the First World War and actively used on 4 different battleships. Even having to reline them and build new mountings was significantly easier and cheaper than building a brand new gun. Here is a good page on gun barrel construction. I agree that age does not necessarily mean they aren't useful. These coastal guns are not really going to be used that much, unless they are in the Atlantic Wall such as the German's used them, or on the islands in the Med and the English Channel. There were others and I have a book on European fortresses. However, if they have been used a lot, re-refiled, then droop might have set in and re-rifling might have cause them to be less accurate. But they are a good cost per performance weapon for the purpose. www.eugeneleeslover.com/USNAVY/GUN-BARL-CONSTRUCTION-1.html |
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Post by secondcomingofzeno on Apr 16, 2020 21:47:35 GMT -6
*There really should be a way to convert scrapped ships into coastal artillery with discount since that's what much of it was. Yes! I've asked for this before! It should be ingame, to make use of all those old large caliber guns. Coastal batteries aren't quite as good as a ship, but I don't want all those 12 inch guns going to waste. |
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