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Post by sjpc302 on Jan 1, 2022 12:54:12 GMT -6
A design checkbox for additional ammo for secondary/tertiary weapons would be very helpful for ships with DP armament. For valuable ships whose primary defense against both destroyers and aircraft is the same weapon, it would be nice to have the option to take 50%-100% more ammo, with the appropriate weight increases of course. It is frustrating to know that your ships will run out of secondary ammo from engaging destroyers, but not be able to design for that. While an ammo count was rightfully not included for secondaries for unneeded complexity, a check box for extra ammo alongside the director, DP and autoloader options shouldn't create unnecessary confusion. For the future dlc, assuming ROF changes are made with the engine to make weapons like the OTO Melara behave properly, more ammo will be necessary across the board as well.
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Post by williammiller on Jan 3, 2022 8:57:50 GMT -6
That is an interesting suggestion, thanks sjpc302 . |
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Post by seawolf on Jan 3, 2022 14:30:25 GMT -6
That is an interesting suggestion, thanks sjpc302 . Just to add on, while the in game rpg for secondaries is 150, and that's historical for mid-calibre WWI secondaries, the historical rounds got up to 500 for WWII era 5" secondaries. I suggest that the primary and secondaries be able to carry up to 450 rounds(The mechanics already work for it, I've modded the game to check) |
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Post by christian on Jan 4, 2022 6:09:21 GMT -6
That is an interesting suggestion, thanks sjpc302 . Just to add on, while the in game rpg for secondaries is 150, and that's historical for mid-calibre WWI secondaries, the historical rounds got up to 500 for WWII era 5" secondaries. I suggest that the primary and secondaries be able to carry up to 450 rounds(The mechanics already work for it, I've modded the game to check) Heavily agree on this smaller guns should be able to go up to 450 rounds atleast (some in WW2 carried as high as 550 per gun) and as seawolf pointed out its already possible for the mechanics to accommodate this |
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Post by jwsmith26 on Jan 4, 2022 11:05:50 GMT -6
I do think that AA ammo should be increased, but a shortage of ammo for AA guns was not always a result of insufficient capacity in the ships themselves. In the Mediterranean, the British ran short on AA ammo for the entire theatre several times and ships had to sail with such short supplies that all ammo was expended in the first aerial encounter. Aircraft encounters can occur at any time and AA gunners are not known for parsimony when an enemy plane is within range. It is quite possible that ships might have encountered enemy air prior to the initiation of the battle being simulated in the game. If AA ammo is substantially increased, as it probably should be, it seems that there should also be a mechanism that would randomly reduce the supply for some ships.
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akd
Full Member
Posts: 126
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Post by akd on Jan 4, 2022 12:18:46 GMT -6
I’m not sure a checkbox for vague “more ammo” (which you won’t find out the direct effect of until you have the ship in battle) is any more or less complicated than simply allowing the player to specify rounds per gun with some sort of logical defaults depending on type (e.g. different, increasing defaults for BL, QF, QF-DP, Auto-DP) and with reasonable upper and lower limits.
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Post by oldpop2000 on Jan 4, 2022 13:52:42 GMT -6
The issue for DE's, DD's, light cruisers is stowage space. It's nice to conceive of putting more ammunition on the ships, but where? The hallways, in the turrets, in stowage lockers on the side of ships. This is the problem the British had in the Med in convoy protection. Repeated attacks by the Italian and German aircraft depleted the ammunition supplies. I suspect the Axis power knew this. How do you do it in the game? Does the game represent the stowage space.
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Post by seawolf on Jan 4, 2022 15:34:55 GMT -6
The issue for DE's, DD's, light cruisers is stowage space. It's nice to conceive of putting more ammunition on the ships, but where? The hallways, in the turrets, in stowage lockers on the side of ships. This is the problem the British had in the Med in convoy protection. Repeated attacks by the Italian and German aircraft depleted the ammunition supplies. I suspect the Axis power knew this. How do you do it in the game? Does the game represent the stowage space. The game pretty heavily abstracts stowage space. I mean, you can put two double 4" guns next to each other on a destroyer in game which is absolutely not possible due to space and stability on even a 2500 ton hull in real life. |
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Post by oldpop2000 on Jan 4, 2022 15:52:14 GMT -6
The issue for DE's, DD's, light cruisers is stowage space. It's nice to conceive of putting more ammunition on the ships, but where? The hallways, in the turrets, in stowage lockers on the side of ships. This is the problem the British had in the Med in convoy protection. Repeated attacks by the Italian and German aircraft depleted the ammunition supplies. I suspect the Axis power knew this. How do you do it in the game? Does the game represent the stowage space. The game pretty heavily abstracts stowage space. I mean, you can put two double 4" guns next to each other on a destroyer in game which is absolutely not possible due to space and stability on even a 2500 ton hull in real life. Yes, that is what I thought. Forget the stowage issue. |
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Post by wlbjork on Jan 4, 2022 15:56:10 GMT -6
The game pretty heavily abstracts stowage space. I mean, you can put two double 4" guns next to each other on a destroyer in game which is absolutely not possible due to space and stability on even a 2500 ton hull in real life. That would mean the Tribal Class don't exist, which mounted twin 4.7" turrets in the A,B, X, Y positions. Unless you're meaning Wing Guns, if so I do apologise as I haven't thought about mounting twin wing guns on a DD hull |
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Post by seawolf on Jan 4, 2022 19:52:57 GMT -6
The game pretty heavily abstracts stowage space. I mean, you can put two double 4" guns next to each other on a destroyer in game which is absolutely not possible due to space and stability on even a 2500 ton hull in real life. That would mean the Tribal Class don't exist, which mounted twin 4.7" turrets in the A,B, X, Y positions. Unless you're meaning Wing Guns, if so I do apologise as I haven't thought about mounting twin wing guns on a DD hull I meant double wing mounts... in fact, you can have a destroyer with double turrets and cross deck fire! |
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Post by christian on Jan 5, 2022 4:00:33 GMT -6
I do think that AA ammo should be increased, but a shortage of ammo for AA guns was not always a result of insufficient capacity in the ships themselves. In the Mediterranean, the British ran short on AA ammo for the entire theatre several times and ships had to sail with such short supplies that all ammo was expended in the first aerial encounter. Aircraft encounters can occur at any time and AA gunners are not known for parsimony when an enemy plane is within range. It is quite possible that ships might have encountered enemy air prior to the initiation of the battle being simulated in the game. If AA ammo is substantially increased, as it probably should be, it seems that there should also be a mechanism that would randomly reduce the supply for some ships. This is already accounted for as land based AA will usually fly over your ships a few times before you get to battle ranges airstrikes also reduce secondary ammo significantly due to AA and on top of that AA ammo after battle would be effected still due to land based AA attacking again while the battle is ending / both sides are returning to port in my experience running out of secondary and tertiary ammo happens as early as half to an hour into battle (without mods) and with mods you can run out even faster the only ships which have more than one engagement worth of ammo are carriers (only against air targets) and usually them having to fight a single DD force will reduce their ammunition by around 50% |
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